Arrangement of letters in a word

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves determining the number of distinct 4-letter words that can be formed from the letters of the word "BOOKLET," which contains 7 letters including a duplicate letter (two O's).

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the reasoning behind subtracting permutations involving the duplicate letters and question the validity of the original solution's approach.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants examining different interpretations of how to account for the duplicate O's in their calculations. Some express agreement with the book's answer while others seek clarification on the reasoning behind it.

Contextual Notes

There is uncertainty regarding the correct method to account for the duplicate letters, with various approaches being proposed and debated. Participants are also considering the implications of counting arrangements with different assumptions about the letters.

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Homework Statement


In how many ways 4-lettered words that can be formed using the letters of the word "BOOKLET".

The book solution solve it this way.
The word contains 7 letters out of which there are 2 O's. So there are 6 letters.
∴ The number of 4 lettered words
= 7P4 - 6P4 = 840 - 360 = 480

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


What we need is to deduct the duplicate counting of 2 O's from the total permutation.
So how does 6P4 solve this purpose.

Instead of 6P2,
isn't it should have been
( 4P2 * 5P2 ) / 2
i.e number of ways these 2 O's can be placed in 4 place * number of ways B,K,L,E,T can be placed in the remaining 2 places divide by 2.

= (12 * 20)/2 =120

And the answer would be 840 - 120 = 720 and not 480.
 
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It is not only the words with two Os that are double counted in 7P4.
 
rajeshmarndi said:
Instead of 6P2
isn't it should have been
Correction it is 6P4

Orodruin said:
It is not only the words with two Os that are double counted in 7P4.
But I do not see any other letters being doubled.
My question, is the book solution, correct, any way?
 
rajeshmarndi said:
But I do not see any other letters being doubled.
Imagine the two Os in different colours. In all the words corresponding to 7P4, which words only differ in colour pattern?
(I agree with the book answer, though I've yet to understand how they obtain it by subtracting 6P4.)
 
haruspex said:
Imagine the two Os in different colours.
I understood that and that's why I mentioned them as O1 & O2.
haruspex said:
In all the words corresponding to 7P4, which words only differ in colour pattern?
I am not sure if I've understood you correctly, if we imagine the two Os in different colours(and each unique letter to be a different colour), then 7P4 will result all to be in different colour.[/QUOTE]
haruspex said:
(I agree with the book answer, though I've yet to understand how they obtain it by subtracting 6P4.)
Where am I wrong in my below solution.
rajeshmarndi said:
Instead of 6P2,
isn't it should have been
( 4P2 * 5P2 ) / 2
i.e number of ways these 2 O's can be placed in 4 place * number of ways B,K,L,E,T can be placed in the remaining 2 places divide by 2.

= (12 * 20)/2 =120

And the answer would be 840 - 120 = 720 and not 480.
 
rajeshmarndi said:
Where am I wrong in my below solution.
Consider BLO1K, BLO2K.
 
haruspex said:
Imagine the two Os in different colours. In all the words corresponding to 7P4, which words only differ in colour pattern?
(I agree with the book answer, though I've yet to understand how they obtain it by subtracting 6P4.)

I called them O and O' in my mid, the principle is the same. I too have not understood how they arrive at it being 6P4 other than numerical coincidence. I solved it by first considering all words as double counted and then adding those that this removes by error (i.e., half of the 4 letter words made from BKLET).
 
haruspex said:
Consider BLO1K, BLO2K.
Yes, thanks, it just didn't hit my mind.
 
But, I am still not yet clear.

As 7P4 - 6P4 = number of words containing 2 Os (including O1 & O2)

, since 6P4 = total permutation without 2 Os in the word.
 
  • #10
rajeshmarndi said:
But, I am still not yet clear.

As 7P4 - 6P4 = number of words containing 2 Os (including O1 & O2)

, since 6P4 = total permutation without 2 Os in the word.
Yes, but it's coincidence. 360 have no Os, 240 have one O, 180 have two. It just happens that 360=(240+180)/2.
I can make an argument for subtracting 46P3. Consider the number that have a specific O (whether or not they have both).
 
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  • #11
haruspex said:
360 have no Os, 240 have one O, 180 have two.
5! = 120 has no Os, 4*5*4*3 = 240 has one O, (4!/(2!)^2)*5*4 = 120 has two Os. The sum of all of these is 480, alternatively you subtract 240+120 = 360 from 840 and get the same result.

haruspex said:
360=(240+180)/2
Average of 240 and 180 is 360? :rolleyes:
 
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  • #12
Orodruin said:
5! = 120 has no Os, 4*5*4*3 = 240 has one O, (4!/(2!)^2)*5*4 = 120 has two Os. The sum of all of these is 480, alternatively you subtract 240+120 = 360 from 840 and get the same result.Average of 240 and 180 is 360? :rolleyes:
I shouldn't post while watching Le Tour.
 

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