How many ways can you arrange the letters from 'GREEN' with at least one 'E'?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the problem of arranging the letters in the word "GREEN" with the condition that at least one 'E' must be included in the arrangement. Participants are exploring combinatorial methods to determine the number of valid arrangements.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the total arrangements without restrictions and attempt to subtract cases where 'E' is absent. There are considerations of arrangements with one 'E' and two 'E's, with some questioning the impact of indistinguishable letters on the count.

Discussion Status

Multiple approaches are being explored, including direct counting and splitting the problem into cases based on the number of 'E's. Some participants have noted discrepancies in their calculations and are seeking clarification on how to account for repeated permutations due to indistinguishable letters.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working under the constraints of the problem statement, specifically the requirement that at least one 'E' must be included in the arrangements. There is an acknowledgment of potential errors in counting due to the repetition of letters.

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Homework Statement



In how many ways can the three letters from the word " GREEN " be arranged in a row if atleast one of the letters is "E"

Homework Equations



Permutations Formula

The Attempt at a Solution



The total arrangements without restriction: 5P3/2! = \frac{5!}{2! * 2!}

The number of arrangements in which there is no "E" = 3!

Ans : 5P3/2! - 3! = 24 (wrong)

Here is another approach :

The arrangements with just one "E" = \frac{2!*4!}{2!}
The arrangements with two "E" = \frac{3*2}{1}

I think I making a mistake due to the repetition of "E" ... Can anyone of you tell me a better way which avoids the problem I am being having .
 
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If "at least one letter must be E", that means that the other two letters must be chosen from "GREN". That is, the first letter must be one of those 4 letters, the second one of the three remaining letters. How many is that?

But then we can put the "E" that we took out into any of three places: before the two, between them, or after the two letters so we need 3 times that previous number.
 
HallsofIvy said:
If "at least one letter must be E", that means that the other two letters must be chosen from "GREN". That is, the first letter must be one of those 4 letters, the second one of the three remaining letters. How many is that?

But then we can put the "E" that we took out into any of three places: before the two, between them, or after the two letters so we need 3 times that previous number.

4P2 = 4*3

According to your method the answer should be 12 * 3 = 36 (The correct answer in the solutions is "27")

Clearly your method (as did mine) repeats some of the permutations :

You didn't take onto account that the two "E" are not distinct. Thus in those permutations where we chose two "E" were repeated. see :
GEE , EEG, EGE
ENE, EEN, NEE
REE, ERE , EER
 
hms.tech said:
4P2 = 4*3

According to your method the answer should be 12 * 3 = 36 (The correct answer in the solutions is "27")

Clearly your method (as did mine) repeats some of the permutations :

You didn't take onto account that the two "E" are not distinct. Thus in those permutations where we chose two "E" were repeated. see :
GEE , EEG, EGE
ENE, EEN, NEE
REE, ERE , EER

Alternatively, split the problem into two: Count those combinations with only 1 E and then count separately those with two E's.

For one E combination: (1C1)*(3C2)*3! = 18
For two E combination: (2C2)*(3C1)*(3!/2!) = 9. Then add.
 

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