Asymptote of expected rotation curve velocities

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the expected rotation curve velocities of outer stars in spiral galaxies, specifically addressing why these velocities have an asymptote greater than zero. The conversation touches on theoretical aspects of astrophysics, particularly the rotation curve problem and the implications of dark matter.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the logic behind the asymptotic velocity of outer stars in spiral galaxies, citing NGC 3198 as an example where the asymptote appears to be around 40-50 km/s.
  • Another participant explains that the rotation curve problem arises because the observed rotation curves do not decrease as expected based on known gravitational laws applied to observable matter, leading to the hypothesis of dark matter halos that could account for the flattening of these curves.
  • A clarification is made regarding the distinction between expected and observed velocity curves, with a reference to a specific graph indicating an expected asymptote of about 35-40 km/s.
  • One participant provides a mathematical explanation, stating that at large distances, the velocity decreases as the square root of the radius, which results in a very slow approach to zero, thus explaining the observed asymptotic behavior.
  • A later reply expresses satisfaction with the mathematical explanation provided, indicating it addressed their initial query.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of the rotation curve problem and the role of dark matter, with some focusing on the mathematical aspects while others emphasize the observational discrepancies. The discussion does not reach a consensus on the broader implications of these findings.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about gravitational behavior at large distances and the nature of dark matter, which remain unresolved. The mathematical explanation provided relies on specific conditions that may not encompass all scenarios in galaxy dynamics.

Buckethead
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Can someone tell me why the expected velocity of the outer most stars of spiral galaxies has an asymptote quite a bit greater than zero? For example NGC 3198 at a radius of 50 kpc appears to be reaching it's asymptote at about 40-50 km/s which seems illogical.
 
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This is part of the rotation curve problem in Astrophysics. The rotation curve of galaxies do not drop off as expected by applying known laws of gravity on the observable matter. Thus, there is hypothesis of "dark matter halos" that exist all around galaxies. This extra matter (which extends quite far out) can flatten out rotation curves to significant distances from the center of the galaxy.
 
Matterwave said:
This is part of the rotation curve problem in Astrophysics. The rotation curve of galaxies do not drop off as expected by applying known laws of gravity on the observable matter. Thus, there is hypothesis of "dark matter halos" that exist all around galaxies. This extra matter (which extends quite far out) can flatten out rotation curves to significant distances from the center of the galaxy.

I was actually referring to the expected velocity curve, not the observed velocity curve. For example if you look at the graph here:

http://w3.iihe.ac.be/icecube/3_Activities/1_WIMPs%20Analysis/fig1.bmp

It appears that the expected rotation curve has an asymptote at about 35-40 km/s
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Oh, well, that's because velocity only goes down as the square root of r at large distances (outside where luminous matter appear).

Out at very large distances, one could approximate the galaxy as a point source of gravity. In that case, for circular orbits:

[tex]v=\sqrt{\frac{GM}{r}}[/tex]

As r goes up, v goes down, but only as a square root. This function is asymptotic to 0 as r goes to infinity, but is very slowly doing so. At distances that the graph has, the function doesn't approach zero quickly.
 
Matterwave said:
Oh, well, that's because velocity only goes down as the square root of r at large distances (outside where luminous matter appear).

Out at very large distances, one could approximate the galaxy as a point source of gravity. In that case, for circular orbits:

[tex]v=\sqrt{\frac{GM}{r}}[/tex]

As r goes up, v goes down, but only as a square root. This function is asymptotic to 0 as r goes to infinity, but is very slowly doing so. At distances that the graph has, the function doesn't approach zero quickly.

Excellent! That was the answer I was looking for. Thank you!
 

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