Balancing the Cards: An Exploration

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    Cards Exploration
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a problem involving 14 cards, each with a number between 1 and 1000, and the challenge of dividing these cards into two piles with equal total sums. The conversation explores the validity of the problem statement and potential methods for proving the possibility of such a division.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses embarrassment about asking for clarification on the problem, indicating a desire to understand how to divide the cards into two equal-sum piles.
  • Another participant points out a potential misunderstanding in the problem statement, using an example with specific card values to illustrate that the original formulation may be incorrect.
  • A third participant agrees with the critique of the original problem and suggests a corrected version, proposing a mathematical approach involving sets and the Pigeonhole Principle to demonstrate the existence of two subsets with equal sums.
  • A later reply questions the reasoning behind the calculation of the largest possible sum, suggesting that it should involve the largest 13 numbers rather than only 9, indicating a potential oversight in the previous explanation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally disagree on the interpretation of the original problem statement and its validity. There are competing views on how to approach the solution, with some participants proposing corrections and alternative formulations.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about the nature of the card values and the implications of having an odd number of odd-numbered cards, which may affect the possibility of achieving equal sums. There is also a mention of the number of possible subsets and their sums, which introduces complexity to the problem without resolving it.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in combinatorial mathematics, problem-solving strategies in set theory, or those exploring mathematical proofs related to equal partitioning may find this discussion relevant.

barbiemathgurl
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so embarrased askin so much :redface:

On a table there are 14 cards. On each card there is a number between 1 to 1000. Show it is possible to divide the cards into two piles so that the total sums are the same.
 
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?!
Let card #1 to #13 all have the number 1 and let the 14th card have number 1000. 13 is not the same as 1000. Maybe you read or wrote the problem wrong?
 
quasar987 said:
?!
Let card #1 to #13 all have the number 1 and let the 14th card have number 1000. 13 is not the same as 1000. Maybe you read or wrote the problem wrong?

Though I think she means that all cards have a different number assigned to them, it doesn't take away the fact that the hypothesis presented is wrong. Suffice to have among the fourteen cards an odd number of cards having odd numbers assigned to in order for it to be impossible.
 
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barbiemathgurl said:
so embarrased askin so much :redface:

On a table there are 14 cards. On each card there is a number between 1 to 1000. Show it is possible to divide the cards into two piles so that the total sums are the same.

As the two posters said you have indeed made a mistake.

The correct version of the problem should be:
"Given 14 cards with numbers from 1 to 1000 on them show that you can choose some of those cards to be divided into two piles with equal sums"

For example, as Werg22 said let the cards be:
1,2,...,13,1000
Then your original formulation is false. By the correct formulation on top you can choose some of those cards, i.e. 1,2,3 and divide those into two equal piles, i.e. (1+2) and (3).

To prove this we need to state this problem in a different manner involving sets.
"Let S be a set of 14 numbers, with each number between 1 and 1000. Show that there exists two proper disjoint subsets A and B such that sum(A) = sum(B)"

There are 2^14 - 2 = 16382 possible subsets. Each subset will be assigned a number, that number is the sum of its elements. Now the lowest possible sum is 1 and the largest is 1000+999+...+992 = 8964. So there are 8964 possible set sums. Since 16382 > 8964 there exists two distinct (but not necessarily disjoint) sets A and B with sum(A) = sum(B) by the Pigeonhole Principle. If A and B are disjoint then we are done. If not the remove the elements that they have in common, that will preserve their sums (and the sets do not vanish because they are distinct). So we will end up with two disjoint sets with equal set sums.
 
Kummer,
in your solution, why does the largest sum only have 9 numbers in it? Shouldn't it be the sum of the largest 13 numbers?
 
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