Buoyancy and Archimedes Principle, volume ratio/density question

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a buoyancy problem involving a geode, which is a hollow rock with a solid shell and an air-filled interior. Participants are exploring the relationship between the weight of the geode in air and its weight when submerged in water, using principles of density and buoyancy.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are attempting to apply Archimedes' principle and the concept of buoyancy to determine the volume fraction of the hollow part of the geode. There are questions regarding the appropriate densities to use and how to set up the equations correctly. Some participants express confusion about their calculations and the relationships between the variables.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants sharing their calculations and questioning the validity of their results. Some have provided equations relating the weights of the geode in different states, while others are trying to verify their findings against the problem's conditions. There is no explicit consensus on the correct answer yet, but various interpretations and approaches are being explored.

Contextual Notes

Participants are working under the assumption that the weight and density of air can be neglected, and they are trying to derive relationships based on the given densities of the solid part of the geode and water. There is also mention of the need to calculate the volume of the geode, which is not provided in the problem statement.

phoebz
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A geode is a hollow rock with a solid shell and an air-filled interior. Suppose a particular geode weighs twice as much in air as it does when completely submerged in water. If the density of the solid part of the geode is 3100 km/m^3 , what fraction of the geode's volume is hollow?

The density of air is 1.20kg/m^3 and density of water is 1000, and I have been trying to use the equation Fb (force of buoyancy) = W (weight of the object)

(I use the symbol ρ for density)
I have:
Fb=w
ρ_water(volume)g=ρ_geode(volume)g2

and Vair/Vgeode as my unknown... I'm confused on what densities to use.. and if I'm even on the right track.

Any help would be appreciated!
 
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Neglect the weight and density of the air. Let V be the volume of the geode, and let \varphi be the fraction that is solid. In terms of V, \varphi, and ρs, how much does the geode weight in air. If the geode is fully submerged under water, what is the weight of the water displaced in terms of the volume V and density of water ρw? In terms of these parameters, what is the weight of the geode under water?
 
Okay, for the weight in the air I have: W =Vρsφg

The volume of the water displaced would be the volume of the geode...which we aren't given :s.

But I know the geodes weight under water needs to be multiplied by two to equal the weight of the geode in the air so:

Vρsφg = 2(Vρwg)

solve for φ?

I get φ= 0.645, so then minus that from 1 and I get 0.355... is that about right?
 
Last edited:
I tried putting in my answer for Vair/Vsolid as 0.55 and it was wrong, so I guess I've messed up somewhere
 
Last edited:
phoebz said:
I tried putting in my answer for Vair/Vsolid as 0.55 and it was wrong, so I guess I've messed up somewhere
But according to your previous post you calculated it as .355. Which answer did you give?
 
If the volume of the geode is V, the density of the rock is ρs, and the volume fraction of air is \phi, then the

weight of the geode in air = V\rho_s(1-\phi)g

If the geode is fully submerged, the the

weight of water displaced = V\rho_wg

From Archimedes principle

weight of geode in water = V\rho_s(1-\phi)g-V\rho_wg

The ratio of the geode weight in air to the geode weight in water is:

\frac{V\rho_s(1-\phi)g}{V\rho_s(1-\phi)g-V\rho_wg}=\frac{\rho_s(1-\phi)}{\rho_s(1-\phi)-\rho_w}

This ratio is equal to 2. So, solve for \phi.
 

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