Calculate the maximum voltage that can be applied

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves calculating the maximum voltage that can be applied between a central wire and a conducting cylinder in a Geiger-Muller counter, given the dimensions and dielectric strength of the gas. The subject area relates to electrostatics and electric fields in cylindrical geometries.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss using Gauss's law to derive the electric field and voltage, questioning how to handle the variable electric field and the integration limits. There is also a focus on relating charge per unit length to voltage and electric field.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants exploring different approaches to integrate the electric field and clarify the relationship between charge, voltage, and dielectric strength. Some guidance has been offered regarding the need to consider charge per unit length, but no consensus has been reached on the integration limits or the method to find maximum charge.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the complexities of the problem, including the implications of the dielectric strength and the geometry of the setup, while adhering to homework constraints that prevent direct solutions.

xxwwyytt
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Homework Statement


A detector of radiation called a Geiger-Muller counter consists of a closed, hollow, conducting cylinder with a fine wire along its axis. Suppose that the internal diameter of the cylinder is 3.00 cm and that the wire along the axis has a diameter of 0.2 mm. If the dielectric strength of the gas between the central wire and the cylinder is 1.00 ✕ 106 V/m, calculate the maximum voltage that can be applied between the wire and the cylinder before breakdown occurs in the gas.

Homework Equations


E=-∫Vds
∫EdA = Qenc/ε0

The Attempt at a Solution


Since the electric field is not constant between the cylinder and the wire, I tries to derive for the electric field using Gauss' law from the wire to the cylinder using radius 1.5e-2m and 0.1e-3m. However the equation comes out like Q/(2πlε0)ln(r). l is for the length of the gaussian surface which i don't know and i don't see anywhere that I can cancel l . Besides, I have no idea where I can use that dielectric strength since electric field vary.
 
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xxwwyytt said:
Q/(2πlε0)ln(r). l is for the length of the gaussian surface which i don't know and i don't see anywhere that I can cancel l
You are asked for the maximum voltage, not the maximum charge. The longer the tube and wire, the greater the total charge.
Work with the charge per unit length. Relate that to the voltage and to the field (as function of r).
 
haruspex said:
You are asked for the maximum voltage, not the maximum charge. The longer the tube and wire, the greater the total charge.
Work with the charge per unit length. Relate that to the voltage and to the field (as function of r).
I tried to relate to the E field by using Gauss's Law, and I get E = λ/2πrε0. Integrate E, I get V= (λ/2πε0)ln(r), and then I don't know where I should integrate from. Should I integrate from 1.5e-2m to 0.1e-3m or do I get r by plugging the dielectric strength into the equation of E?
 
xxwwyytt said:
Should I integrate from 1.5e-2m to 0.1e-3m
If you do that, what exactly does the resulting equation tell you?
xxwwyytt said:
do I get r by plugging the dielectric strength into the equation of E?
If you do that, what exactly does the resulting equation tell you?
 
haruspex said:
If you do that, what exactly does the resulting equation tell you?

If you do that, what exactly does the resulting equation tell you?
Thanks! I figure out that I should get Qmax first and then plug in 1.5e-2 and 0.1e-3 to find the Vmax.
 
xxwwyytt said:
Thanks! I figure out that I should get Qmax first and then plug in 1.5e-2 and 0.1e-3 to find the Vmax.
Perhaps, but how do you plan to find Qmax?
 

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