Calculating Ring Capacitance: MKS Units & Math Involved

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the capacitance of a ring and the related tension in the ring due to electrostatic forces. Participants are exploring the mathematical complexities involved, particularly in the context of MKS units and the implications of using different mathematical approaches.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to understand the derivation of the capacitance formula and its applicability in MKS units. Some participants mention the involvement of complex mathematics, including elliptic integrals and toroidal functions. Others express difficulty in understanding these concepts and question the consistency of the formula across different unit systems.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively discussing various mathematical approaches to the problem, with some expressing confusion over specific integrals and their convergence. There is recognition of the challenges posed by treating charge as distributed on an infinitely thin wire, and suggestions are made to consider the physical thickness of the wire in calculations.

Contextual Notes

There are mentions of constraints related to the mathematical complexity of the problem, including the divergence of certain integrals and the implications of wire thickness on the calculations. Participants are navigating these challenges without reaching a consensus on the best approach.

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I was reading the following thread at stackexachange.
http://physics.stackexchange.com/qu...e-electrostatic-force-does-wire-thickness-mat

The first answer calculates the radial force using the capacitance of ring. Any ideas how the poster derived the formula for capacitance? Is the formula different for MKS units? I am interested in deriving it if it doesn't involves too much of mathematics.

Any help is appreciated. Thanks!
 
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Last edited:
gneill said:
Nasty math including complete elliptic integrals, toroidal functions, and recurrence relations; see:

The Capacitance of and Anchor Ring

Nope, I definitely cannot understand that. Does the formula remains same in MKS unit?

Btw, I am much more interested in calculating tension in the ring. I tried calculating force on a single particle which subtends a very small angle of ##2\alpha## at the center. The charge on this small part is ##\lambda R (2\alpha)## where ##\lambda## is the linear charge density and R is the radius of ring. It is obvious that that the force on this small particle is horizontal in direction (along the radius R). Consider another particle subtending angle ##d\theta##. Charge on this is ##\lambda (Rd\theta)##. The force due to second particle on first is
dF=\frac{k\lambda^2 R^2 2\alpha d\theta}{r^2}
where ##r^2=4R^2\sin^2(\theta/2)## (calculated from the law of cosines).
Integrating the component along the horizontal direction i.e integrating ##dF\sin(\theta/2)##
F=\int_0^{2\pi} \frac{k\lambda^2 R^2 2\alpha d\theta}{4R^2\sin (\theta/2)}

But wolframalpha says that its not possible to calculate the above integral. :confused:

Thank you!
 

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Pranav-Arora said:
F=\int_0^{2\pi} \frac{k\lambda^2 R^2 2\alpha d\theta}{4R^2\sin (\theta/2)}

But wolframalpha says that its not possible to calculate the above integral. :confused:
It clearly diverges near θ=0. This is not uncommon when treating charge as distributed on an infinitely thin wire. In reality, wires have thickness, and this becomes important at close quarters between the two regions of charge being considered in the integral. A possible way around it is to use a different approximation for that part of the integration where the two elements are within a distance equal to the wire's thickness, or thereabouts.
 

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