Can a Black Hole Firewall Limit Energy and Entropy?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of black holes, specifically focusing on the firewall hypothesis and its implications for energy, mass, and entropy in relation to black hole evaporation. Participants explore the nature of singularities and horizons, as well as the potential for alternative models that challenge traditional views.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the formation of a firewall around a black hole after Page time would limit the increase of energy/mass and entropy, suggesting that energy is contained within the singularity.
  • Another participant proposes that if the firewall hypothesis is true, it implies the absence of an interior singularity, leading to an unknown state of matter within the black hole.
  • A participant raises a question about the relationship between singularities and event horizons, asking what causes the horizon if there is no singularity present.
  • A later reply references a paper that suggests an alternative to singularities, proposing a model that addresses the information loss problem and eliminates the need for a firewall.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the existence and implications of singularities and firewalls, indicating that multiple competing models and interpretations remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the complexity of the concepts involved, including the dependence on definitions of singularities and horizons, and the implications of the firewall hypothesis on black hole physics.

jamg.97
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I was thinking about how a black hole evaporates and the firewall idea. If after Page time a firewall forms around the black hole, does that mean that the energy/mass, and entropy cannot increase anymore? The energy of the black hole is essentially supposed to be in the singularity, right? I think that is how it has an increase in energy. If the object coming into the black hole hits the firewall, then it cannot reach the singularity. Am I wrong about this? Am I misunderstanding a concept? Please help me clarify this.
 
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For starters, taking the firewall hypothesis as true, any quantum gravity theory of which it is a part would have no interior singularity. Instead, there would be some not yet understood state of matter distributed in some not yet understood way in the interior. Can you try to rephrase your question with this in mind?
 
Isn't the singularity what makes the horizon? The horizon is a point of no return, but what causes it if there is no singularity?
 
jamg.97 said:
Isn't the singularity what makes the horizon? The horizon is a point of no return, but what causes it if there is no singularity?

One possible answer to that question is this paper: google "rovelli star"
which will direct you to http://arxiv.org/abs/1401.6562.

It conjectures what is there instead of a "singularity" (a mathematical breakdown with infinite density)
and resolves the information loss problem, also gets rid of firewall. So you might be interested.
 
Wow! This is quite an awesome paper. Thank you for sharing.
 

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