Can Every Surjection Have a Right Inverse Without the Axiom of Choice?

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter Unit
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Axiom Choice
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the question of whether every surjective function can have a right inverse without invoking the Axiom of Choice. Participants explore the implications of surjections, injections, and the role of the Axiom of Choice in establishing the existence of right inverses.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that for a surjection g:X→Y, one can define an injection f:Y→X using the Axiom of Choice to select elements from the pre-images of each element in Y.
  • Others argue that the existence of a right inverse for every surjective function is equivalent to the Axiom of Choice, suggesting that without it, such a proof may not be possible in the general case.
  • A participant mentions that while the general case may require the Axiom of Choice, specific cases, such as finite sets, might not.
  • Another participant references the Cantor–Bernstein–Schroeder theorem as related to the topic, indicating a connection to established mathematical principles.
  • One participant clarifies the notation and conventions used in discussing surjective and injective functions, emphasizing the importance of clarity in mathematical communication.
  • It is noted that while every surjection can have a right inverse under the Axiom of Choice, the reverse implication also holds, suggesting a deeper equivalence between the two concepts.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the Axiom of Choice plays a crucial role in the existence of right inverses for surjective functions. However, there is disagreement regarding whether a proof can exist without it, particularly in the general case.

Contextual Notes

Some limitations are noted regarding the dependence on the Axiom of Choice and the implications for different types of sets, such as finite or countable sets. The discussion also highlights potential confusion in notation and conventions used in mathematical expressions.

Unit
Messages
181
Reaction score
0
I thought of this today while eating apples.

Suppose we have two arbitrary sets X and Y and a surjection g:X→Y. We seek an injection f:Y→X. Each element of Y has at least one pre-image in X, but there might be more than one; the nonempty sets X_y = \{ x\in X : g(x) = y \} are subsets of X, indexed by Y. In fact, they partition X, for if we had x\in X_a\cap X_b then, by definition, a = g(x) = b. Thus these sets are pairwise disjoint; by the axiom of choice, there exists a function h such that h(X_y) \in X_y for all y \in Y. From here, we can define the injection f(y) = h(Xy).

Is there a proof which does not use the axiom of choice?
 
Physics news on Phys.org


Unit said:
I thought of this today while eating apples.

Suppose we have two arbitrary sets X and Y and a surjection g:X→Y. We seek an injection f:Y→X. Each element of Y has at least one pre-image in X, but there might be more than one; the nonempty sets X_y = \{ x\in X : g(x) = y \} are subsets of X, indexed by Y. In fact, they partition X, for if we had x\in X_a\cap X_b then, by definition, a = g(x) = b. Thus these sets are pairwise disjoint; by the axiom of choice, there exists a function h such that h(X_y) \in X_y for all y \in Y. From here, we can define the injection f(y) = h(Xy).

Is there a proof which does not use the axiom of choice?



In the general case? I highly doubt it. For particular cases it may be,

for example for finite X (and, thus, finite Y), or perhaps some weak case of AC if X is countable...

DonAntonio
 


That every surjective function has a right inverse is equivalent to the axiom of choice.
 
Last edited:


Unit said:
I thought of this today while eating apples.

Suppose we have two arbitrary sets X and Y and a surjection g:X→Y. We seek an injection f:Y→X. Each element of Y has at least one pre-image in X, but there might be more than one; the nonempty sets X_y = \{ x\in X : g(x) = y \} are subsets of X, indexed by Y. In fact, they partition X, for if we had x\in X_a\cap X_b then, by definition, a = g(x) = b. Thus these sets are pairwise disjoint; by the axiom of choice, there exists a function h such that h(X_y) \in X_y for all y \in Y. From here, we can define the injection f(y) = h(Xy).

Is there a proof which does not use the axiom of choice?

I think you might have this a little backward, but let me try to straighten this out. You can tell me if I'm understanding you correctly.

To get to the conclusion right away: As jgens noted, the statement "every surjection has a right inverse" is equivalent to the Axiom of Choice. I think it's what you're getting at.

When doing problems with maps between two sets, there's a convention that f goes left to right and g goes right to left. It's very confusing to start with g:X->Y. So if you don't mind I'll change your notation to conform to this convention.

So we have f:X \rightarrow Y a surjection.

For each y \in Y we can define the inverse image of y, exactly as you have it above:

f^{-1}(y) = X_y = \{ x\in X : f(x) = y \} and for each y this is a nonempty set.

Now the collection of sets f^{-1}(y) does of course partition X; and using the Axiom of Choice we can define g:Y \rightarrow X by choosing g(y) \in f^{-1}(y).

Then it's clear that for each y we have fg(y) = y. We say that g is a right inverse of f. And we have just proved that AC implies that every surjection has a right inverse.

[Remember that fg means we do g first! This is a common point of confusion]

It turns out that you can go back the other way: "Every surjection has a right inverse" implies AC. [Needs proof of course.] So they are equivalent.

I'm not sure where you were going with the bit about an injection; so if I'm not sure if I answered the question you actually meant to ask. However I seem to recall that every injection has a left inverse; and this does not require any form of Choice.
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

Replies
5
Views
6K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
4K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
1K
Replies
1
Views
6K
  • · Replies 61 ·
3
Replies
61
Views
12K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K