Can objects in nature store light information on the quantum level?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion explores the concept of whether objects in nature, such as dinosaur bones or crystals, can store light information at the quantum level, potentially allowing retrieval of images from the past. It touches on theoretical implications, speculative ideas, and references to fictional narratives.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants reference a fictional scenario where light absorbed by stones could be used to retrieve images of the past, questioning its feasibility in reality.
  • One participant argues that the phenomena related to slow light and electromagnetically induced transparency require very precise conditions and cannot occur naturally, suggesting that stored images are not present in the environment.
  • Another participant notes that while materials can be affected by light exposure over long periods, the information retrievable from such artifacts would be minimal.
  • Questions are raised about the possibility of quantum entanglement allowing for the retrieval of images from the past, with skepticism about the practicality of such an idea.
  • Participants discuss the need for physicists to have existed in the past to create entangled photons and the challenges of maintaining coherence over millions of years.
  • References to recent experiments in entangling particles are made, but participants express doubts about their relevance to the original question.
  • One participant mentions a related fictional story about "slow glass," indicating interest in the intersection of science and fiction.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally express skepticism about the feasibility of retrieving images from ancient photons, with multiple competing views on the nature of light storage and quantum entanglement. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the original question posed.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the speculative nature of the ideas discussed, dependence on precise definitions of phenomena like slow light and quantum entanglement, and the lack of empirical evidence supporting the claims made.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in the intersection of quantum physics, speculative science, and fictional narratives may find this discussion engaging.

Maximum7
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TL;DR
I’m trying to figure out if objects in nature can store light
In the 1934 novel by John Taine, Before the Dawn, scientists are able to retrieve images of the past by accessing the light absorbed by stones throughout history. While this is fictional, 1934 was really before the dawn of quantum physics.

In the far future, could we retrieve images from light stored in dinosaur bones or rocks or crystals at the quantum level to see accurate images from the past like what dinosaurs really looked like?

My research has led me to this phenomenon https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetically_induced_transparency and I wonder if it is relevant to what I want. It leads to slow light which I know is a real phenomenon. But I wonder if light from 65 million years ago+ is still in these objects at the quantum level
 
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Maximum7 said:
In the far future, could we retrieve images from light stored in dinosaur bones or rocks or crystals at the quantum level to see accurate images from the past like what dinosaurs really looked like?
No.

Maximum7 said:
My research has led me to this phenomenon https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetically_induced_transparency and I wonder if it is relevant to what I want. It leads to slow light which I know is a real phenomenon. But I wonder if light from 65 million years ago+ is still in these objects at the quantum level
No. The phenomena referred to in the Wikipedia article you reference require very precisely tuned materials and very precisely tuned experimental procedures. They are not anything that is going to happen naturally.

For an analogy, consider that we can store images on photographic film or in digital media, but that doesn't mean stored images are everywhere in our environment. Stored images on photographic film or in digital media are the results of particular, precisely designed processes that don't happen naturally. That's why there are no stored images on film or digital media of dinosaurs from 65+ million years ago even though all the materials we make cameras and photographic film and digital media from were present on Earth back then. The processes that lead to "slow light" or "stopped light", as far as "storing images" is concerned, are just extremely expensive and inefficient ways of doing what cameras and film/digital media already do very cheaply--but just as with cameras and film/digital media, they only happen under precisely designed conditions.
 
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As @PeterDonis has said, nothing fits the bill of what you are describing. Certainly a material can be affected by exposure to light - especially a long-term exposure to direct sunlight, and the change could even be retained for millions of years. But you would be underwhelmed by the information that could be gathered from such an artifact.
 
.Scott said:
As @PeterDonis has said, nothing fits the bill of what you are describing. Certainly a material can be affected by exposure to light - especially a long-term exposure to direct sunlight, and the change could even be retained for millions of years. But you would be underwhelmed by the information that could be gathered from such an artifact.
Okay. So there is no way to get images from the past through ancient photons?
 
Maximum7 said:
Okay. So there is no way to get images from the past through ancient photons?
No.
 
PeterDonis said:
No.
What about photons quantumly entangled through time?
 
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Maximum7 said:
What about photons quantumly entangled through time?
What do you mean by this?
 
PeterDonis said:
What do you mean by this?
Could we create an entangled pair of photons; one in 2024 and one 65,000,000 mya to allow us to see what a skeleton of a dinosaur looked like right after it died. I recently learned that scientists could entangle particles on their own. Yet I know QE cannot allow for transfer of information but is an image the same thing as a written message? Yeah, right?
 
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Maximum7 said:
Could we create an entangled pair of photons; one in 2024 and one 65,000,000 mya to allow us to see what a skeleton of a dinosaur looked like right after it died.
No. We would have to have had physicists around 65 million years ago to do the creating then. Plus some way of keeping photons coherent for 65 million years so we could complete the measurement now. And of course we have neither of those things.

Maximum7 said:
I recently learned
Where? Please give a reference.

Maximum7 said:
that scientists could entangle particles on their own. Yet I know QE cannot allow for transfer of information but is an image the same thing as a written message? Yeah, right?
Without a reference I can't tell. But this doesn't sound like anything that's actually valid.
 
  • #10
@Maximum7 I have changed the level of this thread to "B". You clearly do not have sufficient background knowledge for an "A" level or even an "I" level discussion.
 
  • #11
PeterDonis said:
No. We would have to have had physicists around 65 million years ago to do the creating then. Plus some way of keeping photons coherent for 65 million years so we could complete the measurement now. And of course we have neither of those things.


Where? Please give a reference.


Without a reference I can't tell. But this doesn't sound like anything that's actually valid.
https://research.princeton.edu/news...r the first time, a,apart, or indeed, even if
 
  • #12
Maximum7 said:
https://research.princeton.edu/news/physicists-‘entangle’-individual-molecules-first-time-bringing-about-new-platform-quantum#:~:text=For the first time, a,apart, or indeed, even if
This experiment is not about "entangling particles on their own". We already know how to entangle individual particles, such as pairs of electrons or photons. This experiment was new in that it entangled molecules, i.e., systems consisting of multiple particles.

That said, nothing in this experiment demonstrates anything that would make anything you have asked about in this thread possible.
 
  • #13
Maximum7 said:
Okay. So there is no way to get images from the past through ancient photons?
Galaxy NGC 3972 is about 65 million light-years away. So with a telescope ...
But, no, not images of ancient forests.
 
  • #14
Maximum7 said:
TL;DR Summary: I’m trying to figure out if objects in nature can store light

In the 1934 novel by John Taine, Before the Dawn, scientists are able to retrieve images of the past by accessing the light absorbed by stones throughout history. While this is fictional, 1934 was really before the dawn of quantum physics.

In the far future, could we retrieve images from light stored in dinosaur bones or rocks or crystals at the quantum level to see accurate images from the past like what dinosaurs really looked like?

My research has led me to this phenomenon https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetically_induced_transparency and I wonder if it is relevant to what I want. It leads to slow light which I know is a real phenomenon. But I wonder if light from 65 million years ago+ is still in these objects at the quantum level
One of my favorite short stories is "light of other Days" (1966)about slow glass. Not much science there but an interesting story. Anybody read it?
 
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hutchphd said:
One of my favorite short stories is "light of other Days" (1966)about slow glass. Not much science there but an interesting story. Anybody read it?
I remember a story like that… been a while…
 
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