Categories - Bland Chapter 3 - Problem 2 - Problem Set 3.1

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around Problem 2 from Problem Set 3.1 in Paul E. Bland's book "Rings and Their Modules," specifically focusing on the concept of initial objects in the category Set. Participants are exploring the implications of having a morphism from the empty set to another set and the nature of functions in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Peter expresses confusion about how a function can exist from the empty set to another set, questioning the nature of morphisms in this case.
  • Some participants propose that the set of functions from the empty set to any set contains exactly one morphism, which is the empty relation.
  • One participant explains that a function is defined as a relation from the domain to the codomain, and since the empty set has no elements, the only relation possible is the empty relation.
  • Another participant reiterates the explanation of morphisms from the empty set, emphasizing that this leads to the conclusion that the empty set is an initial object in the category Set.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the interpretation of morphisms from the empty set, but there is still some uncertainty and reflection on the implications of this agreement. The discussion remains open-ended with no definitive consensus reached.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the abstract definitions and implications of functions and morphisms, which may depend on their interpretations of these concepts. The discussion reflects varying levels of understanding and comfort with the material.

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I am reading Paul E. Bland's book, "Rings and Their Modules".

I am trying to understand Section 3.1 on Categories.

At present I am working on Problem 2 in Problem Set 3.1 and I need some help in understanding the problem and its solution.

Problem 2 (Problem Set 3.1) reads as follows:https://www.physicsforums.com/attachments/3602Now in the category Set we have:

$$\mathscr{O}$$ is the class of all sets - that is the objects are sets

and

If $$A, B \in \mathscr{O} $$ then $$\text{Mor} (A,B)$$ is the set of all functions from $$A$$ to $$B$$ ...

Now Bland's definition of an initial and final object are as follows:https://www.physicsforums.com/attachments/3603

Now if $$\emptyset$$ is an initial object, then $$\text{Mor} (\emptyset, B)$$ has exactly one morphism $$f \ : \ \emptyset \rightarrow B$$ ... ...

... ... BUT ... ... how can we have a set function emanating from a set with no elements ...

Can someone please clarify this issue/problem?

Peter
 
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Hi Peter,

I have never rode such a strange thing, so I'm not really sure of what I'm going to say, but I think here could be an agreement.

If you consider the sets $A,B$ and the set $C=\{f:A\longrightarrow B \ : \ f \ \mbox{is an application}\}$

Then we know that in general $\#(C)=\#(B)^{\#(A)}$ and $\#(\emptyset)=0$, hence we can agree that $C_{\emptyset}=\{f:\emptyset \longrightarrow B \ : \ f \ \mbox{is an application}\}$ has one element.

A different question would be if this agreement make sense or not.
 
Fallen Angel said:
Hi Peter,

I have never rode such a strange thing, so I'm not really sure of what I'm going to say, but I think here could be an agreement.

If you consider the sets $A,B$ and the set $C=\{f:A\longrightarrow B \ : \ f \ \mbox{is an application}\}$

Then we know that in general $\#(C)=\#(B)^{\#(A)}$ and $\#(\emptyset)=0$, hence we can agree that $C_{\emptyset}=\{f:\emptyset \longrightarrow B \ : \ f \ \mbox{is an application}\}$ has one element.

A different question would be if this agreement make sense or not.
Thanks for the help, Fallen Angel ...

Hmmm ... not sure ... still reflecting and thinking about this matter ...

Does anyone else have a viewpoint on this ... ... ?

Peter
 
Peter said:
Thanks for the help, Fallen Angel ...

Hmmm ... not sure ... still reflecting and thinking about this matter ...

Does anyone else have a viewpoint on this ... ... ?

Peter

Hi Peter,

You've asked a very good question. The abstract definition of a function $f : A \to B$ is a relation from $A$ to $B$ (i.e., a subset $R$ of $A \times B$) such that for every $a \in A$, there is a unique $b \in B$ such that $(a,b) \in R$ (and we typically write $f(a) = b$ when $(a,b) \in R$). Hence, given an object $B$ of SET and a morphism $f \in \text{Mor}(\emptyset, B)$, $f$ is viewed as a relation from $\emptyset$ to $B$, in other words, a subset of $\emptyset \times B$. Since $\emptyset \times B = \emptyset$, $f$ is determined by the empty relation. Conversely, the empty relation gives a morphism from $\emptyset$ to $B$. Therefore, $\text{Mor}(\emptyset, B)$ has only one element. Since $B$ was an arbitrary object of SET, $\emptyset$ is the initial object of SET.
 
Euge said:
Hi Peter,

You've asked a very good question. The abstract definition of a function $f : A \to B$ is a relation from $A$ to $B$ (i.e., a subset $R$ of $A \times B$) such that for every $a \in A$, there is a unique $b \in B$ such that $(a,b) \in R$ (and we typically write $f(a) = b$ when $(a,b) \in R$). Hence, given an object $B$ of SET and a morphism $f \in \text{Mor}(\emptyset, B)$, $f$ is viewed as a relation from $\emptyset$ to $B$, in other words, a subset of $\emptyset \times B$. Since $\emptyset \times B = \emptyset$, $f$ is determined by the empty relation. Conversely, the empty relation gives a morphism from $\emptyset$ to $B$. Therefore, $\text{Mor}(\emptyset, B)$ has only one element. Since $B$ was an arbitrary object of SET, $\emptyset$ is the initial object of SET.
Thanks for the help, Euge ...

Still reflecting on what you have written, but I get the idea, I think ...

Most helpful ... thanks again ...

Peter
 

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