Schools Choosing the Right Graduate Program: Factors to Consider Beyond Rankings

[Ashley1nOnly]

I’m currently trying to decide which of the following schools to attend:

Ohio state University
Indiana University
Florida State University

I would like to go into nuclear or high energy physics. I’ve contacted the schools and I had great interviews with the professors and I enjoyed the environment. I’m just in a dead lock to pick a school.

Indiana ranks 7 in nuclear physics so I’m not sure if I should just go with ranking or how should I make a final decision.

 

[Vanadium 50]

Wasn't the deadline like two weeks ago?

Did you visit any of these places? Columbus and Talahassee each have 10x as many people as Bloomington, so their character is very different.

 

[Ashley1nOnly]

I have until the 3rd of May to decide. I was just given acceptance into the program on the 27th so I don’t have time to go to any of the schools.

 

[Choppy]

I don't have any particular insight into any of the schools, but if after you sit down and really try to evaluate things and they still seem to be coming out on par with each other academically and in terms of potential projects and professors, consider the following as possible tie-breakers:
- cost of living in the city and your financial support level
- peripheral programs (e.g. do they have a university teaching program for graduate students?)
- commute times
- clubs and extra-curricular activities that you find interesting
- city life/environment

Basically, if the programs seem equal consider the factors that will most strongly affect your own ability to succeed.

 

[jasonRF]

One thing to consider is the preliminary exam situation. Every university and department does them differently. It is worth knowing when they are taken, what fraction typically pass, whether you can take it again, etc.

I certainly used this in my decision making. One of my top choices would decide how many students would pass prior to the exam. So each student would take the exam, they would then rank the students and draw the line at the pre-determined rank. Even with two chances to take the exam before getting kicked out it scared me away.

Jason

 

[Vanadium 50]

. So each student would take the exam, they would then rank the students and draw the line at the pre-determined rank.

Why is this scary? Why is it scarier than the overall pass rate?

 

[jasonRF]

Why is this scary? Why is it scarier than the overall pass rate?

It has been a long time but I recall the typical pass rate of 50-60%. This was the EE department at Stanford in the mid-1990s. A brother of a friend of mine had just finished his grad work in that department, and his exam consisted of separate oral exams from a handful (I cannot recall the exact number) of professors; each would ask him questions and give a score individually, and the scores of each were simply added together. Different students had different professors and hence different questions and scoring, so there was some luck involved. My friend's brother failed the first time, but passed the second; the professors he had the second time were better suited to his strengths. What scared me was that this fellow had graduated in the top 10 in his class at Caltech, so it was clear that failure was a reasonable possibility. It was not the only reason I chose another school, but it certainly was a factor I considered.

 

[Vanadium 50]

I agree that the overall pass rate is scary, but why is the mechanism scary?

Either students are ranked, in which case everyone scoring above the lowest passing student also passes, or they are not, in which case it's possible to outscore a passing student and still fail. Personally, I find the second scenario scarier than the first.

Then, either a predetermined number of students pass or they look at the scores to decide how many. But even in the latter case, there is at least a soft cut off: the number of students the department can support. If they can support 20, maybe they will take 19 or 21 (and hope it works out) but they can't take 50. But the harsh laws of economics sets this limit - and ultimately this is closely tied to the pass rate. So while I agree that the pass rate can be scary (and it affected my decision on where to go) I don't see that this procedure is particularly scary, and it's better than some.

 

[jasonRF]

Perhaps I shouldn't have used the word "scary", and my first post should have either been much shorter (without the example) or better written with more pertinent facts included. Along with the pass rate, the "luck of the draw" component didn't sound good to me, as my ability to answer unique questions from information theory, control systems or computer architecture professors could determine whether I could study plasma physics. I ended up in a program where the exams were given by faculty in the specialty the student wanted to work in, and who knew what funding they would have available to support students in that specialization. I do not know how the overall pass rates compare, but I was much happier to take my chances with that arrangement. it just worked better for my personality.

Anyway, I didn't mean to hijack this thread. The point of my first post was that if the OP was having a hard time deciding that it wouldn't hurt to look at the exams as it may help with the decision process. It may be even more helpful to simply know the final outcomes of the students that enter the program at that school, such as the number that typically finish degrees within 8 years. If the information is not readily available I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[analogdesign]

I agree that the overall pass rate is scary, but why is the mechanism scary?

I went to a University with a similar mechanism (not Stanford). It was terrifying. As JasonRF indicated what makes it scary is the element of luck. You randomly get assigned professors to ask you questions. Some are easy on the students, some are brutal. That means that if you had two equal students one could pass and the other could fail based solely on luck. This is not cool.

What would be much less "scary" would be a standardized test.

I agree that looking at the graduation rate would be useful for the OP (as the screening exam is part of that).

 

[donpacino]

I’m currently trying to decide which of the following schools to attend:

Ohio state University
Indiana University
Florida State University

I would like to go into nuclear or high energy physics. I’ve contacted the schools and I had great interviews with the professors and I enjoyed the environment. I’m just in a dead lock to pick a school.

Indiana ranks 7 in nuclear physics so I’m not sure if I should just go with ranking or how should I make a final decision.

Academics are obviously very important, but there is more to choosing a college than just rankings.

Where are you from?
Do you have a strong desire to live in florida, or ohio, or indiana?
Are there companies near any of the colleges that you want to some day work for?
Are there attractions near the colleges that you want to get involed with (ex, you're a beach person, florida might be better than indiana).
choppy mentioned others as well.

Think about what you want to do (its ok if you don't know). Look at what people from the particular schools have done with their degrees and compare them.