Closed Packing: Definition & Planes

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the definition of closed packing, particularly in relation to the arrangement of atoms as spheres in both three-dimensional and two-dimensional contexts. Participants explore the implications of the term "close packing" and its geometric significance.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants seek clarification on the definition of closed packing and its relation to close packing planes, suggesting that atoms cannot be packed closer together.
  • There is a distinction made between "close packing" and "closed packing," with some participants asserting that the term refers to the arrangement of spheres in three-dimensional space.
  • One participant questions whether the definition necessitates that atoms be considered as spheres, prompting further exploration of the geometric context.
  • Participants discuss the existence of cubic close packing and hexagonal close packing as specific arrangements of spheres, noting that these configurations lead to crystal structures.
  • There is an inquiry into the application of close packing in two-dimensional arrangements, with some participants affirming that it can indeed be applied in 2D, despite the common focus on 3D crystal lattices.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying interpretations of the terms "closed packing" and "close packing," with no consensus reached on a singular definition. The discussion includes both agreement on the geometric principles involved and differing views on the necessity of considering atoms as spheres.

Contextual Notes

Some limitations include the ambiguity surrounding the definitions of closed packing versus close packing, as well as the implications of treating atoms as spheres versus other shapes. The discussion also highlights the potential for confusion when transitioning between 2D and 3D contexts.

gracy
Messages
2,486
Reaction score
83
what is definition of closed packing?a close packing plane is a plane that the atoms cannot be packed any closer?
 
Chemistry news on Phys.org
gracy said:
what is definition of closed packing?a close packing plane is a plane that the atoms cannot be packed any closer?
That's "close packing,", not "closed." Yes, it means that atoms, taken as spheres, cannot be closer to one-another. See http://departments.kings.edu/chemlab/animation/clospack.html
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: gracy
DrClaude said:
it means that atoms, taken as spheres, cannot be closer to one-another.
atoms have to be sphere? in definition word sphere is present?
 
The term "close packing" comes from the part of geometry that deals with the packing of spheres, i.e., how to arrange spheres in 3D. There are two packing of spheres which the density of the spheres, cubic close packing and hexagonal close packing. If you take the center of the spheres in these packing configurations to be the position of an atom, you will find crystal structures that have the same arrangement as these close-packed sphere. Therefore, by taking the atom as a sphere, you can imagine that the crystal structure results from the atoms being as close as possible to each other. Of course, atoms are not spheres and don't have fixed sizes, so can always put them closer together (e.g., by compression).

I found a better link than my previous suggestion:
http://chemwiki.ucdavis.edu/Wikitex...es_of_Matter/Cubic_Lattices_and_Close_Packing
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: gracy
DrClaude said:
, i.e., how to arrange spheres in 3D
what about 2D?is close packing not applied in 2D?
 
gracy said:
what about 2D?is close packing not applied in 2D?
Yes, you can apply it to 2D. It is just that crystal lattices are usually 3D. I'm sorry if I led you astray by discussing spheres in 3D. But the links I gave also discuss the 2D case.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: gracy
DrClaude said:
Yes, you can apply it to 2D. It is just that crystal lattices are usually 3D. I'm sorry if I led you astray by discussing spheres in 3D. But the links I gave also discuss the 2D case.
Thanks a lot.May God bless you.
 

Similar threads

Replies
2
Views
2K
Replies
15
Views
4K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
7K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
6K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
7K
  • · Replies 31 ·
2
Replies
31
Views
3K
Replies
79
Views
10K