Confused about gibbs free energy

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the Gibbs free energy and its applicability under constant temperature and pressure conditions in thermodynamics. Participants explore the implications of Gibbs free energy in chemical reactions and the equations associated with it.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether Gibbs free energy is only valid at constant pressure and temperature, noting that their calculations suggest a change in Gibbs free energy (ΔG) equals zero, which seems incorrect given that reactions occur under these conditions.
  • Another participant confirms that Gibbs free energy is indeed used for constant pressure and temperature scenarios, contrasting it with Helmholtz free energy for constant volume and temperature, but expresses uncertainty about the equations presented.
  • A third participant challenges the application of certain equations, stating that it is incorrect to equate ΔS as q/T or ΔH/T for irreversible reactions, and notes that a chemical reaction at equilibrium cannot perform work.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the application of Gibbs free energy and the validity of the equations used, indicating that the discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing interpretations.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the assumptions made regarding the conditions of reactions and the definitions of thermodynamic quantities, which remain unresolved in the discussion.

jd12345
Messages
251
Reaction score
2
Wikipedia says :
In thermodynamics, the Gibbs free energy (IUPAC recommended name: Gibbs energy or Gibbs function; also known as free enthalpy[1] to distinguish it from Helmholtz free energy) is a thermodynamic potential that measures the "useful" or process-initiating work obtainable from a thermodynamic system at a constant temperature and pressure (isothermal, isobaric).

So is gibbs free energy only valid for constant pressure and temperature?
I tried to find change in gibbs free energy of a chemical reaction under these conditions and it always comes zero.

ΔG = ΔH - TΔS ... temperature is constant
ΔG = ΔH - TΔH/T... at constant pressure q = ΔH
ΔG = 0

there is something wrong in this as reactions do happen at constant pressure and temperature adn gibbs free energy change is not zero
 
Chemistry news on Phys.org
The Gibbs (free) energy is used in cases of constant pressure and temperature, just as the Helmholtz (free) energy is used in cases of constant volume and temperature.

Other than that, I am not entirely sure what you are trying to do with those equations. Certainly, some reactions do occur spontaneously under constant temperature and pressure while others don't, depending on the value of the Gibbs (free) energy for that process.
 
Various people already tried to convince you that in case of an irreversible reaction it is not correct to equate Delta S as q/T or Delta H/T.
A chemical reaction in equilibrium will in deed not be able to do work.
 
Got it - thanx
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
3K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
12K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
3K