Conservation of energy regarding electrons

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a problem involving the conservation of energy and momentum in a collision between a moving electron and an atom. The scenario describes an atom initially at rest that can transition to an excited state upon absorbing the electron, which introduces the concept of "bound state energy" in relation to the system's kinetic energy.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the nature of the collision, questioning whether it is inelastic and what "bound state energy" means. There are attempts to clarify the relationship between kinetic energy before and after the collision, as well as the implications of the energy lost during the process.

Discussion Status

Some participants are seeking a clearer conceptual understanding of the problem, particularly regarding the definitions and implications of "bound state energy." There is an ongoing exploration of how energy and momentum conservation applies to the scenario, with various interpretations being considered.

Contextual Notes

Participants express confusion over the terminology used in the problem, particularly regarding "bound state energy," and some indicate a lack of prior knowledge about these concepts. The discussion reflects a mix of attempts to apply formulas and a desire for deeper understanding.

theowne
Messages
14
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement


An atom of mass M is initially at rest, in its ground state. A moving (nonrelativistic) electron of mass m_e collides with the atom. The atom+electron system can exist in an excited state in which the electron is absorbed into the atom. The excited state has an extra, "internal," energy E relative to the atom's ground state.

To be honest, I am very confused reading this. The problem system I am going through has a section where you can ask for hints and for the most part that's mostly how I've been trying to complete this, but a more clear explanation of what this is saying would be helpful.

Homework Equations


Kinetic energy = 1/2 mv^2
Momentum = mv

The Attempt at a Solution



Well using the hints, first I was asked to find the final velocity of the atom, supposing the initial velocity was v_0. So using conservation of momentum I found it.

Here's the work I did so far:

help.jpg


So I eliminated it and got K final = (Kinitial * m_e) / (m_e + M)

But where to go from here? I tried for a long time but I don't understand this problem at all. The answer given is this:

K_e = ([M + m_e] / M) * E

Can someone please tell me how they got this answer?

As you can see I don't need the answer, I just want to understand this problem~! The most confusing aspect to me is what this E is supposed to represent, where it comes in, I don't get it..
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The collision is inelastic. Energy and momentum are conserved, but not kinetic energy. The bound state energy E should be equal to K_initial-K_final. K_initial is K_e, the energy of the incoming electron.
 
How do you know it is inelastic from the question? What is "bound state energy"? And how is that used to get the answer that the software gives me?
 
It's inelastic because K_initial is not equal to K_final. The difference is the "bound state energy", the "extra internal energy E" that the problem talks about. And if had read my answer you would know how to find it. I told you: E=K_initial-K_final.
 
I'm sorry, I do not understand the initial question's wording about "bound state energy". I have never learned such a thing and I don't quite understand the question...I know how to plug things into formulas, I was hoping for a conceptual explanation of what this question describes...but you seem annoyed so I will ask elsewhere, thanks anyways.
 
Apologies for being annoyed. That wasn't very patient of me. In a general inelastic collision where the two colliding objects stick together some energy is lost. You can compute the amount just by conservation of momentum. That's what the question is asking you to do. Whatever is lost in kinetic energy has to appear some place else. That's the E. If it's two pieces of putty, then you say the lost energy goes into heat and acoustic vibration. The question is encouraging you to think of it as going into pushing the target atom into an excited state, for example an atom with a extra bound electron. But it doesn't really matter where you think of it as going. You can still compute the amount by the difference between the kinetic energy of the incoming state minus the kinetic energy of the outgoing state. Sorry again to be annoyed.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
3K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
11K
Replies
12
Views
2K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
2K
Replies
55
Views
6K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
953
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
3K