Could There Be a Place in the Universe That's Completely Black?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the possibility of a location in the universe that is completely devoid of light and radiation, exploring concepts related to empty space, electromagnetic radiation, and the future state of the universe. It touches on theoretical implications and the nature of radiation in various contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • VE questions whether there could be a location in the universe that is completely black, without any light from distant galaxies or other sources.
  • Some participants assert that as long as there are no obstacles, light and radiation will continue to travel, suggesting that completely empty space does not exist.
  • VE proposes that empty space may not exist based on current understanding, as electromagnetic radiation is thought to permeate all regions of space.
  • Another participant mentions that in the far future, the universe may approach a state of emptiness, but the timeframe is uncertain and depends on unknown physics.
  • One participant raises the idea that a temperature difference is necessary for energy exchange and information transfer, questioning the implications for detecting radiation in a hypothetical empty space.
  • There is a suggestion that even if radiation exists, if two objects are at the same temperature, no signals or information can be exchanged between them.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the existence of completely empty space and the conditions under which radiation can be detected. There is no consensus on whether a completely black region can exist, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge limitations in current understanding of physics and the future of the universe, indicating that assumptions about radiation and temperature differences may affect the discussion.

ValenceE
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Hello to all !,

given our current physics and cosmology theories and understanding of the universe, could there be an 'open space' location from where we could not see any light, as faint as can be, coming from distant galaxies or light source ?... pitch black all around us...


regards,

VE

Edit: actually, if the answer is yes, than can we expand the 'blackness' to any and all currently measurable radiation ?
 
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Space news on Phys.org
Short answer - no. As long as there are no obstacles to light or radiation, it will continue to travel. For example, the cmb can be detected in all directions.
 
Thank's for the reply,

so then, am I right in stating that, given what we presently know, we can safely say that empty space does not exist ?


VE
 
ValenceE said:
Thank's for the reply,

so then, am I right in stating that, given what we presently know, we can safely say that empty space does not exist ?


VE
Space that is "empty" of EM radiation cannot exist within our understanding of the universe. There will always be EM suffusing it, no matter where you are. Even if you dug a deep cave in the Earth and hid in that, particles (neutrinos) would be zipping through you day and night. No place to hide.
 
Certainly not now. Evolve the universe forward some 10^100 years or so, and it will be effectively completely empty (note: the actual timeframe depends upon the exact nature of physics which we don't yet understand, but the fact that it will happen we can be reasonably confident about). See here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Future_of_an_expanding_universe
 
Is this true? Doesn't there have to be a temperature difference as well as existence of radiation? If I, my instruments are at the same temperature as some other place there is no energy exchange between us, I can receive no signals or information from it even though there still is EM radiation? Nor send any. If there are places not like that, I could notice its presence by its absence IYKWIM. Sounds crazy at first, but doesn't every info we get depend on on a temperature difference? - a star or tungsten filament emits radiation which, maybe after reflection reaches us.
 
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epenguin said:
Is this true? Doesn't there have to be a temperature difference as will as existence of radiation? If I, my instruments are at the same temperature as some other place there is no energy exchange between us, I can receive no signals or information from it even though there still is EM radiation? Nor send any. If there are places not like that, I could notice its presence by its absence IYKWIM. Sounds crazy at first, but doesn't every info we get depend on on a temperature difference? - a star or tungsten filament emits radiation which, maybe after reflection reaches us.
Right, which is why there won't be any regions in the universe that are entirely empty until the universe itself is.
 

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