Determining Smoothness Of A Function

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves determining the smoothness of a function defined on a manifold, specifically a function f that extracts the k-th coordinate from a point p in a chart. The discussion centers around the relationship between the smoothness of f and the smoothness of a related function F, which is defined in terms of the chart's inverse.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the implications of the calculation of partial derivatives and question the definition of smoothness in the context of multiple coordinate charts. There is discussion about whether f can be defined relative to a single chart or if it can extend to other charts in the neighborhood.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants seeking clarification on the relationship between the function and the coordinate charts. Some guidance has been provided regarding the implications of the derivative calculations, but there is no explicit consensus on the definitions or assumptions being made.

Contextual Notes

There is a mention of the need for clarity regarding the definitions of smoothness and the relationship between different coordinate charts, as well as the implications of the calculations performed on the function F.

Alex86
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1. The problem statement:

Given a chart \varphi, define a function f by f(p) = x^{k}(p), the k-th coordinate of p (where k is fixed). Is f smooth?

2. Homework Equations :

f is smooth (C^{k}) iff F is smooth (C^{k}), where F: \Re^{n} \rightarrow \Re, F = f \circ \varphi^{-1}

The Attempt at a Solution



\frac{\partial F}{\partial x^{i}} = \sum_{m} \frac{\partial f}{\partial x^{m}} \frac{\partial x^{m}}{\partial x^{i}}

\frac{\partial F}{\partial x^{i}} = \sum_{m} \frac{\partial x^{k}}{\partial x^{m}} \frac{\partial x^{m}}{\partial x^{i}}

\frac{\partial F}{\partial x^{i}} = \delta^{k}_{m} \frac{\partial x^{m}}{\partial x^{i}}

\frac{\partial F}{\partial x^{i}} = \delta^{k}_{i}

I'm not sure if this shows what I'm after as I'm not sure exactly what smoothness means in a given situation.

Thanks in advance for any input.
 
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I forgot to point out that the function "f(p)" is defined on a manifold where p is a point on the manifold.
 
It seems like f can only be defined in the domain of, and relative to, a single coordinate chart; is this what you intend?

Given that, you have the correct calculation. What does the calculation \partial F/\partial x^i = \delta_{ik} tell you about the higher derivatives of F?
 
Last edited:
I'm not entirely sure what you mean by the first question... why would it only be defined in the domain of and relative to a single coordinate chart? Could there not be another chart in an open neighbourhood which also includes p? The chart in the question seems very general to me.

As for the second question does that mean that the function and the chart are C^{\infty} related?
 
Alex86 said:
I'm not entirely sure what you mean by the first question... why would it only be defined in the domain of and relative to a single coordinate chart? Could there not be another chart in an open neighbourhood which also includes p? The chart in the question seems very general to me.

Suppose x: U \to \mathbb{R}^n and y: V \to \mathbb{R}^n are two coordinate charts (the same functions you have been denoting \varphi) defined on open neighbhorhoods U and V of p. The kth coordinate functions x^k: U \to \mathbb{R} and y^k: V \to \mathbb{R} need not have anything to do with each other.

Alex86 said:
As for the second question does that mean that the function and the chart are C^{\infty} related?

No, that's not what I meant. Denoting the chart again by x instead of \varphi, F = x^k \circ x^{-1} : x(U) \to \mathbb{R} is a function on an open subset x(U) of \mathbb{R}^n. You know its partial derivatives: \partial F/\partial x^i = \delta_{ik}. This contains all the information you need to compute all the higher derivatives of F, and thus tell whether F is a C^\infty function (from an open subset of \mathbb{R}^n to \mathbb{R}; no need for coordinate charts here).
 

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