Differentiation in spherical coordinates.

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the differentiation of a function defined in spherical coordinates, specifically the function u(r,θ,φ) = 1/r. Participants explore the implications of this function's independence from the angular variables θ and φ, as well as the application of the Laplacian operator in this context.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that since u(r,θ,φ) = 1/r is independent of θ and φ, the partial derivatives ∂u/∂θ and ∂u/∂φ are both zero.
  • Others confirm that the Laplacian of u can be simplified to only include terms involving r, leading to the conclusion that ∇²u = 0 when r > 0.
  • A participant notes that the result for the Laplacian is valid as long as r is not zero, suggesting that the behavior at r = 0 should be considered for certain applications.
  • Another participant introduces the concept of the delta function, indicating that ∇²(1/r) is proportional to δ(r), which is zero for r ≠ 0, but significant in the context of electrostatics.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the mathematical treatment of the function u(r,θ,φ) for r > 0, but there is a recognition of the need to address the implications at r = 0, indicating an unresolved aspect of the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the assumption that r > 0 in the analysis, as well as the dependence on the interpretation of the delta function in relation to electrostatics.

yungman
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1) If [itex]u(r,\theta,\phi)=\frac{1}{r}[/itex], is [itex]\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {\theta}}=\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {\phi}}=0[/itex] because [itex]u[/itex] is independent of [itex]\theta[/itex] and[itex]\;\phi[/itex]?

2) If [itex]u(r,\theta,\phi)=\frac{1}{r}[/itex], is:
[tex]\nabla^2u(r,\theta,\phi)=\frac{\partial^2{u}}{\partial {r}^2}+\frac{2}{r}\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {r}}+\frac{1}{r^2}\frac{\partial^2{u}}{\partial {\theta}^2}+\frac{\cot\theta}{r^2}\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {\theta}}+\frac{1}{r^2\sin\theta}\frac{\partial^2{u}}{\partial {\phi}^2}=\frac{\partial^2{u}}{\partial {r}^2}+\frac{2}{r}\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {r}}=0[/tex]

Because [itex]\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {\theta}}=\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {\phi}}=0[/itex].

Thanks
 
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yungman said:
1) If [itex]u(r,\theta,\phi)=\frac{1}{r}[/itex], is [itex]\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {\theta}}=\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {\phi}}=0[/itex] because [itex]u[/itex] is independent of [itex]\theta[/itex] and[itex]\;\phi[/itex]?
Yep.
yungman said:
2) If [itex]u(r,\theta,\phi)=\frac{1}{r}[/itex], is:
[tex]\nabla^2u(r,\theta,\phi)=\frac{\partial^2{u}}{\partial {r}^2}+\frac{2}{r}\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {r}}+\frac{1}{r^2}\frac{\partial^2{u}}{\partial {\theta}^2}+\frac{\cot\theta}{r^2}\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {\theta}}+\frac{1}{r^2\sin\theta}\frac{\partial^2{u}}{\partial {\phi}^2}=\frac{\partial^2{u}}{\partial {r}^2}+\frac{2}{r}\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {r}}=0[/tex]

Because [itex]\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {\theta}}=\frac{\partial{u}}{\partial {\phi}}=0[/itex].

Thanks
Hint: what is the electrostatic potential of a point charge? What is the charge density of a point charge?

EDIT: hint: Poisson's equation

jason
 
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I guess I should add: your result for question 2 is completely correct as long as r is not zero. But for the kinds of applications I know you care about you will want to care about what happens at zero.
 
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Thank you Jason, I know I can count on you. Yes, I forgot to specify [itex]r>0[/itex].
 
I didn't really think about whether you stated r>0; I am just thinking about how [itex]\nabla^2 \frac{1}{r}[/itex] is proportional to [itex]\delta(r)[/itex], which is of course zero away from r=0, as you say. But for E&M the delta function is key.

Jason
 

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