Discrepancy with Normal Force Problems

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SUMMARY

This discussion centers on the discrepancies in calculating normal force components in Newtonian physics problems. The user compares two approaches: one from a physics textbook that does not include the normal force in the x-component calculation, and another from an online instructional resource that incorrectly applies trigonometric functions to the normal force. The resolution highlights that the x-component of the normal force is indeed zero when aligned with the y-axis, confirming that the y-component equals the normal force itself. The user acknowledges a misunderstanding regarding the application of trigonometric functions in this context.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of Newton's Laws of Motion
  • Familiarity with vector components in physics
  • Basic knowledge of trigonometric functions (sine and cosine)
  • Ability to analyze and set up physics problems involving forces
NEXT STEPS
  • Review the concept of vector decomposition in physics problems
  • Study examples of normal force calculations in inclined planes
  • Learn about the application of trigonometric functions in force analysis
  • Practice solving Newtonian mechanics problems with varying approaches
USEFUL FOR

Students studying physics, educators teaching Newtonian mechanics, and anyone looking to clarify the application of normal force in force analysis problems.

Physkat
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As I try to set up equations regarding Newtonian forces, I am looking for patterns in example problems I read. It's really frustrating then when I see different approaches that I can't see a connection to.

There are two problems that I've attached that seem to solve - what seems to me about the same content - differently.

First, the "physics book" file. This is a problem from on Forces and Newton's Laws of Motion. When calculating Fx, this problem does NOT take into account FN (Normal force). Other problems I have seen set up like this say the "x component of FN is 0, and the y component of FN is FN. The x components in this problem are dealing with W and T, which I get.

Next, look at the screen shots (in succession) I took of my online instructional of the same topic. Here you will see that for a similar object in a similar situation (a block that is on a ramp), they say the x component of FN is FN*cos90, and the y component is FN*sin90. It seems strange because since they have it lined up on the y axis, would not the x component be 0, and the y component be FN? I don't get the rationale for accounting for the cos/sin90 part. I know we are trying to find the angle ultimately, but why the difference in the approaches and how do I differentiate between the two?
Thank you.
 

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Physkat said:
they say the x component of FN is FN*cos90

Physkat said:
would not the x component be 0
And what is the value of cos 90?
 
Oh boy - I feel silly. Zero, of course. Thank you Haruspex. I was so focused on the set up of the problem I looked past that. Then the sin90*FN would simply be FN, as I originally thought. And I also tried to do the screen shot problem in a slightly different way (I tried the ramp sloping down from the right, whereas they had it down from the left), thinking I would get the same answer, but I did not. So I need to go back and see what I did wrong. Anyway, thank you again for this simple insight!
 

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