Does a Photon Bounce? - Learn How Photons Interact with Mirrors

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the interaction of photons with mirrors, specifically whether photons bounce off mirrors like balls or if they are absorbed and re-emitted. Participants explore the theoretical implications of these interactions, referencing concepts from quantum electrodynamics (QED) and related phenomena such as reflection and refraction.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that photons are absorbed and re-emitted when interacting with mirrors, but this is challenged by others who question how this aligns with diffraction principles.
  • There is a discussion about the interpretation of "absorption" and whether it implies a photon is lost and replaced, with some arguing that the concept of indistinguishable photons complicates this interpretation.
  • One participant suggests that the interaction can be modeled using Feynman diagrams, indicating a photon being absorbed and re-emitted, but acknowledges that this is an approximation and not a definitive description of reality.
  • Another viewpoint emphasizes that the interaction involves coherent scattering with many electrons, leading to reflection or refraction based on the collective behavior of these interactions.
  • Some participants express interest in the physical mechanisms behind reflection, questioning whether electromagnetism or electron interactions are responsible, and seeking clarity on the processes involved.
  • There is a mention of Compton scattering as a relevant process, but it is noted that the entire mirror or Earth absorbs the momentum rather than individual electrons recoiling.
  • Participants discuss the implications of quantum entanglement in relation to photon interactions, raising questions about the properties of entangled photons and their interactions with electrons.
  • Clarifications are made regarding the distinction between describing reflected light as photons versus electromagnetic waves, with emphasis on the need to consider all electrons in the mirror rather than specific molecules.
  • Some participants express skepticism about the idea that a single photon interacts with all molecules, linking it to broader quantum mechanics debates such as the double slit experiment.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the nature of photon interactions with mirrors. Multiple competing views and interpretations remain, particularly regarding the processes involved in reflection and the implications of quantum mechanics.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include unresolved definitions of "absorption," the complexity of quantum interactions, and the dependence on various interpretations of quantum mechanics. The discussion reflects a range of assumptions and interpretations that are not universally accepted.

  • #31
reilly said:
My apologies, I misread your superimposed state vector.

But for the life of me, I don't understand how you get such a state. If you could explain via the standard QED interaction and Schrödinger Eq. solutions -- even using non-relativistic perturbative solutions -- I would be most grateful.
Thanks,
Reilly Atkinson

http://arxiv.org/abs/0805.2853" mentions some ways to achieve the desired result in a practical way. Take e.g. the entangled state described by Eq. 27 on page 13:

1/sqrt(2) [|a>|a'> + |b>|b'>]

Here |a> and |b> are spatial modes for a photon and the primed states are different spatial modes for another photon. Then you don't have single photon interference, but you do have interference when you measure two photon correlations. All this is quite obvious.

But if you try to interpret the result classically, you get exactly what I wanted to show: You don't get interference even though the light from the spatial modes a' and b' should interfere classically. In case of the state:

1/sqrt(2) [|a'> + |b'>]

Then there would be inteference. In the classical picture, you cannot see the difference between the two cases. So, it is possible to create classical waves that fail to behave as predicted by classical theory.

This is true, in principle, for all classical wave phenomena. You could theoretically create two sources of sound waves such that they should interfere, yet you can make them fail to interfere if the phonons are in certain entangled states (whith other phonons or with some other degrees of freedom)

So, the conclusion must be that you don't necessarily get classical behavior in the classical limit. Or, perhaps one should say that classical wave phenomena like electromagnetic waves are in fact macroscopic quantum phenomena...
 
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  • #32
Details of the calculation: Does it peak in a particular direction due to interference with other possibilities? You don't have a lattice of electrons in a good metal mirror.
 

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