Does anyone in the US use A4-sized notebooks?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the availability and use of A4-sized notebooks in the United States, contrasting them with the more common 8.5 x 11 inch notebooks. Participants express their frustrations and experiences regarding paper sizes, preferences, and the cultural differences in stationery use between Europe and the US.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes difficulty in finding A4-sized notebooks in the US, expressing a preference for this size due to its compatibility with printed materials.
  • Another participant states that A4 paper is not commonly used in the US, which contributes to the scarcity of A4 notebooks.
  • Some participants mention that while A4 printer paper is available, notebooks in that size are rare.
  • There is a suggestion to use yellow legal pads, although their dimensions differ from A4.
  • One participant explains that the US uses an ANSI standard for paper sizes, which differs from the ISO standard used in Europe.
  • Another participant humorously remarks on the cultural differences in sports terminology, drawing a parallel to the paper size debate.
  • Several participants share links to online sources where A4 paper can be purchased, indicating that it may not be readily available in physical stores.
  • Some express surprise at the commonality of 8.5 x 11 inch paper in the US, noting that it is the standard size for most notebooks and pads.
  • There is mention of universities using A4 paper for international submissions, suggesting a niche use for A4 in academic contexts.
  • One participant reflects on the dimensions of legal pads and their unexpected size variations compared to standard paper sizes.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that A4-sized notebooks are hard to find in the US and that the common paper size is 8.5 x 11 inches. However, there is no consensus on the reasons for this, with various explanations and humorous remarks shared throughout the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the lack of clarity on the specific reasons for the prevalence of 8.5 x 11 inch paper in educational settings and the cultural implications of paper size preferences. There are also unresolved questions about the availability of A4 notebooks in local stores versus online options.

Lavabug
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I'm having a tough time finding paper that I can write on comfortably, I'm used to 4-hole standard A4 sized paper, as this is very common in Europe. I like how I could easily slip in printed problem sheets, book excerpts, or journal articles into my notes and have everything neat and flush, ready for temp or permanent binding, either in a ring binder or spiraled together.

However all I can find in the states are 3-hole 'college ruled' notebooks that don't sit flush with A4 paper, which is driving me a bit nuts. To the point where I'm just using printer paper on a clamp-tablet for consistency.

Is there any reason A4 sized notebooks are so hard to find in the US? Are school and college students forced to use this bizarre 'college ruled' scale paper for any particular reason? I've checked online but most of the options are import stores with pretty inflated prices.
 
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A4, as far as I know, is not used in the US so I'm not surprised you can't find it.
 
Regular printer paper is din A4 and it is plentiful, I just can't seem to find notebooks in that form factor...
 
how about yellow legal pads?
 
Lavabug said:
Regular printer paper is din A4 and it is plentiful

The most common US standard size is 8.5 x 11 inches. A4 and other DIN sizes are unusual in the US. I was surprised to see that staples.com actually sells A4. I don't remember ever seeing it in stores, although I admit to never having looked specifically for it.

It's not so much that students here are "forced" to use 8.5 x 11, it's literally the only size that they know!
 
The USA doesn't use ISO paper sizes because the ISO standard wasn't invented by the USA. They created an alternative ANSI standard in 1996 which (big surprise) is the same as what they were already using.

Resistance is futile. You might as well complain that the World Series isn't an international sports competition :smile:
 
And then there's US football versus almost everyone else's football... :wink:
 
jtbell said:
And then there's US football versus almost everyone else's football... :wink:
Which we in the US call metric football.
 
  • #10
AlephZero said:
Resistance is futile. You might as well complain that the World Series isn't an international sports competition :smile:

But does it converge??
 
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  • #12
jtbell yoiu're right. i updated post to office depot
they'll probably have to order it in, though.
 
  • #13
Lavabug said:
I'm having a tough time finding paper that I can write on comfortably, I'm used to 4-hole standard A4 sized paper, as this is very common in Europe.

Sorry, Dorothy, you're not in Kansas (Europe) anymore.

However all I can find in the states are 3-hole 'college ruled' notebooks that don't sit flush with A4 paper, which is driving me a bit nuts. To the point where I'm just using printer paper on a clamp-tablet for consistency.

They make these wonderful devices called 'hole punches' so you can punch yer own in whatever paper you use.

Is there any reason A4 sized notebooks are so hard to find in the US?

Yes, no one makes this size paper or uses this type of notebook here. Complain to Mead and Ampad, two of the bigger paper suppliers in the US.

Lavabug said:
Regular printer paper is din A4 and it is plentiful, I just can't seem to find notebooks in that form factor...

DIN A4 paper is almost but not quite the same dimensions as US letter size paper. A4 is slightly narrower and a tad longer than Letter size.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_216

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ANSI/ASME_Y14.1

Physics_UG said:
how about yellow legal pads?

Legal pads are 8.5" wide by 14" long, another gift from the legal profession.
 
  • #14
  • #15
This article discusses the differences between DIN and US paper sizes. At the bottom, you will find a list of suppliers for paper and notebooks in DIN format:

http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/iso-paper.html

The list is a few years old and may now be out of date.
 
  • #16
Should be super easy to get off of Amazon. I wouldn't even think to go to an old brick and mortar store for office supplies.
 
  • #17
SteamKing said:
Legal pads are 8.5" wide by 14" long, another gift from the legal profession.
That's what I thought until I got these home. 8.5" X 11.75" :mad:

http://www.officemax.com/catalog/images/397x353/06119746i_01.jpg
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #18
All this is coming as a bit of a shock to me. So 8.5 x 11 in.^2 is the typical printer page size in the US, not A4? I guess that makes things easier, since notebooks/pads of that size areapparently common, so I'll basically have to live with substantially less vertical space. The horror!

... there's always fax paper rolls, I remember using this in grade school math for homework and occasinally handed them in in rolls if I waited too late to copy it to regular paper, much to the teacher's annoyance. :P

dlgoff said:
That's what I thought until I got these home. 8.5" X 11.75" :mad:

http://www.officemax.com/catalog/images/397x353/06119746i_01.jpg

That is pretty much A4, except .2 in. wider and .05 in. taller. So if A4 was the standard for printers in the US I'd stick with that, but fortunately I don't have to and will use the same size paper for everything. I can now sleep peacefully at night, thank you all.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #19
SteamKing said:
Legal pads are 8.5" wide by 14" long, another gift from the legal profession.
dlgoff said:
That's what I thought until I got these home. 8.5" X 11.75" :mad:
The other 2.25" is to cover their fees. :biggrin:
 
  • #20
Most printers can handle a variety of paper sizes. If your printer can handle A4, it can also handle 8.5 x 11". After all, most of the printer guts are made in Japan and China and repackaged and rebranded as HP, Canon, Epson, etc. for retail sale. For years, many HP LaserJet printers used Canon internals for the print engine with a little external HP styling and such. The print cartridges were often interchangeable between certain HP and Canon models.

It seems in the US that universities have started using A4 size paper for a lot of their work, like for international conferences and such, because this size is the standard for submissions. I must admit that 8.5"x11.75" paper is new to me, but the old stand-bys 8.5x11 and 8.5x14 are still quite common.

http://www.staples.com/Staples-8-1-2-inch-x-11-inch-White-Glue-Top-Notepad/product_154120

http://www.staples.com/The-Legal-Pa...rforated-50-Sheets-Pad-12-Pads/product_831293

http://www.staples.com/Staples-8-1-2-inch-x-14-inch-Canary-Perforated-Notepads-Wide/product_163857
 
  • #21
SteamKing said:
After all, most of the printer guts are made in Japan and China and repackaged and rebranded as HP, Canon, Epson, etc. for retail sale.

The part I put in bold reminds me of an old advertising campaign in the UK: "There's nothing so British as a Heinz Baked Bean."

Whatever, life would be interrupted by fewer paper jams if printers, copiers, etc, didn't have to handle both 8.5" and 210mm paper widths.
 
  • #22
AlephZero said:
The part I put in bold reminds me of an old advertising campaign in the UK: "There's nothing so British as a Heinz Baked Bean."
That's funny, since as you're pointing out, there's nothing British about them, Heinz is an American company and the beans are from North America. They were first introduced to Britain in 1886.

In the UK, Ireland, Australia, Hong Kong, Brunei, Malaysia and Singapore the term baked beans usually refers to tinned beans in a tomato sauce, originally imported from American companies including Heinz as an 'exotic' imported convenience food, quite distinct from the French-style cassoulet largely unknown in Britain at that time. Heinz baked beans were first sold in the UK in 1886 in the upmarket Fortnum & Mason store in London as a foreign delicacy at a high price.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baked_beans#United_Kingdom_and_Ireland

The reason I find this comical is that I watched a tv program on British pub food the other day where the cook prepared "baked beans on toast". I was gobsmacked. I've never heard of beans on toast and had no idea that this cheap BBQ side dish was so popular there. Baked Beans are one of the most American foods I can think of.

Anyway, enough off topic posting from me, continue.
 
  • #23
Unfortunately for me, in the UK, there are some websites that assume all printers print on American "letter" size paper. When I print to A4, a few characters on the right hand side are missing.

In such cases, the only option that seems to work is to print landscape instead of portrait.
 
  • #24
DrGreg said:
In such cases, the only option that seems to work is to print landscape instead of portrait.
Got me wondering. Yep; http://www.concordsupplies.com/roaring-spring-landscape-format-writing-pad/99439.html

176890.JPG
 
  • #25
Moleskine makes an A4 sized notebook in both ruled and squared formats. I use the ruled one at work to log all of my calculations/project notes in.
 

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