Does Newtonian gravity bend light?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the bending of light by gravitational fields, specifically examining whether Newtonian gravity can account for this phenomenon as compared to General Relativity (G.R.). Participants explore historical perspectives, mathematical formulations, and the implications of massless photons in the context of gravitational attraction.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question whether Newtonian gravity predicts any deflection of light, given that light was considered massless in Newton's framework.
  • Others propose that Newton's gravitational equations imply that light should be affected by gravity, despite its massless nature.
  • A participant references Einstein's statement that half of the light deflection during a solar eclipse is due to Newtonian gravity, raising questions about the interpretation of this claim.
  • There is a discussion about the implications of special relativity on the mass-energy equivalence of photons and how this might relate to gravitational bending.
  • Some participants argue that if either mass in Newton's gravitational formula is zero, then there would be no gravitational force acting on light, leading to no bending.
  • Contrasting views emerge regarding the relationship between mass, energy, and the behavior of light in gravitational fields, with some asserting that photons have effective mass due to their energy.
  • Historical references are made to Laplace's calculations regarding light and gravity, indicating a long-standing interest in this topic.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether Newtonian gravity can account for the bending of light. Multiple competing views remain regarding the implications of massless photons and the interpretations of gravitational effects on light.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include unresolved assumptions about the nature of massless particles in gravitational fields, the dependence on definitions of mass and energy, and the historical context of light's behavior under gravity.

  • #31
re: needing more than the stress-energy tensor

In GR, the stress-energy tensor is the density of energy and momentum. It is somewhat similar to the charge density in E&M. In E&M, one can interpret the "source" of electromagnetism as a scalar, charge, which has a density given by a rank-1 tensor, the four-current.

In GR, one can interpret the "source" of gravity as energy and momentum (a four-vector) which has a density given by a rank-2 tensor, the stress-energy tensor.

Thus the four-current, multipled by a vector representing a volume, gives the charge density (a scalar) contained in that volume in E&M. The stress-energy tensor, a rank 2 tensor, mutliplied by a vector representing a volume, gives the energy-momentum (a four-vector) contained in that volume.

In order to solve either E&M, one needs more than the distribution of charge. One also needs additional boundary conditions. E&M is linear, so that one can add any homogeneous solution of Maxwell's equations to an inhomogenoeous solution, and the result will still be a solution of Maxwell's equations. In E&M, it's usually more convenient to deal with the electromagnetic potential rather than the fields. In terms of the potential, one talks for instance about the solution to Poisson's equations (in a region where there is charge) or Laplace's equation (in a region that is charge free), but one needs boundary conditions, for instance Direchlett boundary conditions (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boundary_condition) to specify a unique solution.

Gravity is not linear, so it's not as simple as it is for E&M, but one still needs both the stress-energy tensor AND the boundary conditions. Just knowing the source distribution is not enough. A common boundary conditions in E&M is "zero potential at infinity", in gravity a rougly similar assumption is "asymptotically flat space-time" which says that the metric "at infinity" is Minkowskian. The metric coefficeints g_ij obey second order differential equations in GR, so they are formally similar to the potentials in E&M, which also obey second order differential equations. Thus specifying the metric at infintiy is very similar to specfiying the E&M potential at infinity.
 
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  • #32
pervect said:
Gravity is not linear, so it's not as simple as it is for E&M, but one still needs both the stress-energy tensor AND the boundary conditions.
And these boundary conditions are part of the Weyl tensor right?
 

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