Does the Limit of aCn/na Approach 1/a! as n Approaches Infinity?

  • Context: Undergrad 
  • Thread starter Thread starter nhmllr
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Limit Weird
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the limit of the expression aCn/na as n approaches infinity, specifically exploring whether this limit equals 1/a!. Participants examine the reasoning behind this limit, including specific cases and mathematical approximations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that lim n→∞ aCn/na = 1/(a!) and provides reasoning based on the case where a=3, suggesting that aCn behaves like n^3 as n approaches infinity.
  • Another participant challenges this reasoning, stating that aCn actually approaches infinity as n increases and corrects the initial interpretation of aCn, emphasizing that it should be expressed as n(n-1)(n-2)/3!.
  • A later reply suggests using Stirling's approximation for aCn to derive the limit, indicating that this method could yield the correct limit.
  • Another participant supports the original limit claim, explaining that the expansion of {n choose a} leads to a product that approaches 1 as n approaches infinity, thus supporting the limit's validity.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the limit's behavior, with some supporting the original claim and others contesting it. The discussion remains unresolved, with multiple competing interpretations of the limit.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference different mathematical approaches and approximations, indicating that the discussion may depend on specific definitions and assumptions about the behavior of aCn as n approaches infinity.

nhmllr
Messages
183
Reaction score
1
Here's the weird limit:

lim n[itex]\rightarrow[/itex] [itex]\infty[/itex] aCn/na = 1/(a!)

Don't ask how I thought this up, but let me explain my reasoning.
Let's say that a=3. Then aCn = (n)(n-1)(n-2)
And because n is approaching infinity, could it be (n)(n)(n) = n3?

I wouldn't normally think of things like this but if it's true then it helps me out.

The only thing is that (n)(n-1)(n-2)= n3 +something*n2+something*n

And when I graphed it it looked like it approaches zero.
I've never learned limits formally. Thanks.

EDIT: aCn is a Choose n, or n!/(a![n-a]!)
EDIT: Wolfram alpha is amazing http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=lim+(x!/(3!(x-3)!x^3))+as+x->+infinity
Sorry for not trying this before posting. I'd still be interested in other replies as to why this is true, though
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
nhmllr said:
Here's the weird limit:

lim n[itex]\rightarrow[/itex] [itex]\infty[/itex] aCn/na = 1/(a!)

Don't ask how I thought this up, but let me explain my reasoning.
Let's say that a=3. Then aCn = (n)(n-1)(n-2)
And because n is approaching infinity, could it be (n)(n)(n) = n3?
No, because n is not fixed, it is, as you said, approaching infinity.
In any case, aCn= n(n-1)(n-3)/3!, not just n(n-1)(n-2). That goes to infinity as n goes to infinity.

I wouldn't normally think of things like this but if it's true then it helps me out.

The only thing is that (n)(n-1)(n-2)= n3 +something*n2+something*n

And when I graphed it it looked like it approaches zero.
I've never learned limits formally. Thanks.

EDIT: aCn is a Choose n, or n!/(a![n-a]!)
EDIT: Wolfram alpha is amazing http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=lim+(x!/(3!(x-3)!x^3))+as+x->+infinity
Sorry for not trying this before posting. I'd still be interested in other replies as to why this is true, though
Now, this is completely different- you have an [itex]n^3[/itex] in the denominator.
[tex]\frac{_nC_3}{n^3}= \frac{n!}{3!(n-3)!}\frac{1}{n^3}= \frac{n(n-1)(n-2)}{6n^3}[/tex]
Since both numerator and denominator are of third power in n, that limit is 1/6.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I have not tried yet, but a stirling's approximation of [itex]{}_aC_n[/itex] would give the correct limit
[tex]n!\sim\sqrt{2\pi n}\left(\frac{n}{e}\right)^n[/tex]
 
No, you're limit is correct. It's also not that weird. Consider the expansion of [itex]{n\choose a}=\frac{n(n-1)\ldots (n-a+1)}{a!}[/itex]. Then, consider that [itex]\frac{n(n-1)\ldots (n-a+1)}{n^a}=1\cdot (1-\frac{1}{n})\cdot\ldots\cdot (1-\frac{a-1}{n})[/itex]. Each of those factors goes to 1 as [itex]n\rightarrow\infty[/itex], thus the whole product goes to 1 as well. The expression [itex]{n\choose a}n^{-a}[/itex] is the same thing, but divided by [itex]a![/itex].
 

Similar threads

Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
5K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 21 ·
Replies
21
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 25 ·
Replies
25
Views
7K