E=MC2 vs The End: Can Energy Ever Truly Be Destroyed?

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    E=mc2
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the implications of the equation E=mc² and the concept of energy conservation in the context of the universe's eventual fate. Participants explore questions about energy, mass, and the nature of existence, touching on themes of entropy and the "heat death" of the universe.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how energy can be conserved if everything eventually dies, suggesting a cycle of existence.
  • Another participant challenges the clarity of the original question, indicating that mass cannot "die" in the way described.
  • Several participants mention the concept of entropy, with one suggesting that while energy is conserved, entropy increases, leading to a "heat death" scenario for the universe.
  • Examples of energy converting to mass are provided, including fusion of elements heavier than iron, endothermic chemical reactions, and particle creation in accelerators.
  • There are expressions of frustration regarding the clarity of the original post, with some participants suggesting that the question is vague or fragmented.
  • A participant emphasizes the importance of civility in discussions, noting that misunderstandings should not lead to insults.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying degrees of understanding and interpretation of the original question, indicating a lack of consensus. While some agree on the relevance of entropy, others question the framing of the problem and the clarity of the discussion.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved issues regarding the definitions of terms like "death" in the context of mass and energy, as well as the implications of entropy on the universe's fate. The discussion also reflects a range of interpretations of the original inquiry.

Zenparticle
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E=MC2 vs "The End"

I was listening to this Nova audio compilation here:


"[URL
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/einstein/experts.html

It's about E=mc2 or rather an explanation of it through the eyes of a few renowned Physicists. Interesting question popped into my mind. I thought of the laws of the universe; that all things die, all things seek a low energy configuration and all things move in spirals like, circularly. If energy can not be destroyed and anything with mass has energy - how is it everything will die? Or does it mean that it's a some cycle- I just keep seeing this space devoid of matter- where then does this energy go?
 
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The energy just goes and goes and goes... kinda like your post. Sorry, but it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
 
russ_watters said:
The energy just goes and goes and goes... kinda like your post. Sorry, but it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

OK, I may need a lesson in making better posts, and in turn maybe you could take a lesson in; dare I say,being humble?

OK then here is an easy one for you- give me an example of energy converting to mass-
 
Here is three:

The Fusion of elements heavier than Iron.
Endothermic chemical reactions.
The creation of particles by collisions in particle accelerators.

But I agree that I don't see the point of your post and don't really understand the question you are asking?
 
"I was listening to this Nova audio compilation here:



http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/einstein/experts.html

It's about E=mc2 or rather an explanation of it through the eyes of a few renowned Physicists. Interesting question popped into my mind. I thought of the laws of the universe; that all things die, all things seek a low energy configuration and all things move in spirals like, circularly. If energy can not be destroyed and anything with mass has energy - how is it everything will die? Or does it mean that it's a some cycle- I just keep seeing this space devoid of matter- where then does this energy go?"


Sorry man, there are plenty of << deleted by berkeman>> around here waiting to show their superiority. Although your question is a little vague and fragmented, I will try to answer without being a complete << deleted by berkeman>> .

"I thought of the laws of the universe; that all things die, all things seek a low energy configuration and all things move in spirals like, circularly"

First if all it looks like your giving lively characteristics to atomic particles and energy. Mass can not "die" in the terms that you have given it.

"Or does it mean that it's a some cycle- I just keep seeing this space devoid of matter"

In actuallity, space is never really a void. A void is a theoretical concept, and in space probably does not exist. At the very least there are hydrogen atoms. In intergalatic space for example (vast space between galaxies) there is an average of 1 hydrogen atom per square meter. Space is full of dust, runaway atoms, etc.


I'm sure someone else could answer your questions a little better. Hopefully not everyone will treat you like a moron because you're not an english major or an astrophysics.
 
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Zenparticle said:
I was listening to this Nova audio compilation here:


"[URL
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/einstein/experts.html

It's about E=mc2 or rather an explanation of it through the eyes of a few renowned Physicists. Interesting question popped into my mind. I thought of the laws of the universe; that all things die, all things seek a low energy configuration and all things move in spirals like, circularly. If energy can not be destroyed and anything with mass has energy - how is it everything will die? Or does it mean that it's a some cycle- I just keep seeing this space devoid of matter- where then does this energy go?

Probably what you are looking for is the concept of entropy. While energy is conserved, entropy, on the average, always increases. So in general terms, the universe tends towards a "heat death" because of entropy.

http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/end.html

is a good article about current projections about the end of the universe with current standard cosmological models.
 
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Nexus555 said:
Sorry man, there are plenty of << deleted by berkeman>> around here waiting to show their superiority. Although your question is a little vague and fragmented, I will try to answer without being a complete << deleted by berkeman>> .

I'm sure someone else could answer your questions a little better. Hopefully not everyone will treat you like a moron because you're not an english major or an astrophysics.

Let's try to stay civil here, folks. Several of us had trouble understanding the OP, so there's no need to use vulgar language and be insulting to others, whether they are a Mentor or other user of the PF. That is expressly against the PF rules, and will earn infraction points.

Nice post by the new Mentor pervect, BTW. :biggrin:
 
Thank you for your replies. Pervect- That paper was really neat-of course a bit depressing but, I suppose I feel like that when thinking about the "END" of things. You each answered my question, pretty cool for not being able to understand me:rolleyes: THX
 

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