Electron Light Absorption in a Hard Vacuum Diode

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on whether a stream of electrons emitted in a hard vacuum diode can absorb light, specifically focusing on the absorption frequency and the implications of electron behavior in a vacuum. The scope includes theoretical considerations and potential experimental setups involving laser frequencies.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions if electrons in a hard vacuum diode can absorb light and seeks to understand the absorption frequency, indicating an interest in testing various laser frequencies.
  • Another participant mentions the Thomson cross-section for light scattering by electrons, suggesting that the effect may be too small to observe in a vacuum diode due to low electron density.
  • A different viewpoint asserts that a strictly free electron cannot absorb a photon, citing conservation of energy and momentum equations that lead to an unsolvable scenario. However, they acknowledge the possibility of free electron scattering.
  • One participant clarifies that while free electrons cannot absorb photons at the quantum level, in classical electromagnetic scenarios with oscillating electric fields, electrons can absorb energy and be accelerated, drawing parallels to particle accelerators.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the absorption of light by free electrons, with some asserting that it is not possible while others suggest that under certain conditions, energy can be absorbed from an electric field. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specific mechanisms and conditions under which absorption might occur.

Contextual Notes

The discussion involves assumptions about the behavior of electrons in different physical contexts (quantum vs. classical) and the limitations of the experimental setup proposed by the original poster.

Intuitive
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Question.

Does a stream of Electrons emitted in a Hard Vacuum Diode absorb light?

If so what is the absorption Frequency?

This Question is intend for only mean free Electrons in a Hard Vacuum.

I have been wanting to emit some different LASER Frequencies into a Vacuum Diode and see if the Electrons absorb light in the visible spectrum.:bugeye:

The only thing I have to play with is a 50K Fly back Transformer, a Hard Vacuum Diode and a lack of Variable LASER frequency, I need more broad band frequencies to test.:smile:
 
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At optical wavelengths, the scattering of light by electrons is well described by the Thomson cross-section
[tex]\sigma=\frac{8\pi}{3}\frac{\alpha^2}{m^2}[/tex],
in units where hbar and c=1.

My guess is that this is much too small to be observed for the electrons in a vacuum diode. The electron density is just too small.
 
Last edited:
Intuitive said:
Does a stream of Electrons emitted in a Hard Vacuum Diode absorb light?
If so what is the absorption Frequency?
A strictly "free" electron can not absorb a photon. If you write out the energy and momentum conservation equations, you'll find there's three equations in two unknowns - a situation where you do not, in general, have a solution.

This does not preclude the possibility of free electron scattering (as pointed out above). While this scattering cross-section is small, it is not below detection limits in certain cases - notably for cosmologists who study redshifts in photons penetrating hot plasmas.
 
This question really is a bit unclear to me. Having read the responses so far, I think we all are interpreting this in the same way.

As Gokul has pointed out, at the QM scale, a photon cannot be absorbed by a free electron. However, if you go beyond that scale into where classical EM and mechanics apply, a bunch of electrons in an external field with long-enough wavelength, then the situation is a bit different. Here, what you have is nothing more than electrons in an oscillating E-field. When this situation occurs, then yes, the electron DOES absorbs energy from the field and get accelerated along the E-field direction till it reverses.

This is essentially what goes on in a particle accelerator using RF cavities (i.e. not using DC fields). If one monitors the RF field strength in the cavity when there's no electron beam, and then look at the RF field again when the beam is passing by being accelerated, one notices a dip in the RF field when there's an electron beam being accelerated. This is what is known as "beam loading". The electron beam is pulling energy out of the RF field for acceleration.

Of course, the physics and mechanics is a lot more complicated than what I've described. But essentially, this is the technique most particle accelerators use, especially at the various synchrotron centers around the world to accelerate their electron beams.

Zz.
 

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