Energy Generation through Gravity (mining operation monorail)

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the potential for energy generation using a monorail system in an open cast mining operation. Participants explore the feasibility of harnessing gravitational energy from transporting heavy loads of rock, considering the mechanical and electrical design aspects, as well as the implications of energy storage and efficiency.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes generating electricity using a geared drive shaft and chain system connected to the monorail, which transports 250 metric tonnes of rock.
  • Another participant points out that the initial power calculation using horsepower is incorrect, as it conflates mass with power units.
  • Participants discuss the potential energy calculated from the height difference of the monorail, estimating around 13.6 kW of power, but acknowledge that friction and other losses would reduce this value.
  • There is a suggestion that using brakes in conjunction with the generator could help manage the power output.
  • Questions arise about energy storage methods, with one participant inquiring about alternatives to industrial batteries, suggesting the possibility of using stored rocks as a form of energy storage.
  • Another participant compares the proposed system to hydroelectric power generation, noting the finite nature of the rock supply.
  • A participant expresses uncertainty about the torque that can be applied to a gear and seeks formulas to calculate the forces involved in the system.
  • There is a discussion about the potential for using a generator similar to those in wind turbines, with considerations about gearing and torque to achieve desired power outputs.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of understanding and agreement on the technical aspects of the energy generation proposal. While there is some consensus on the feasibility of generating power, there are disagreements regarding the specifics of calculations, efficiency, and the practicality of energy storage solutions.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations in their understanding of the system's efficiency and the complexities of calculating torque and forces involved. There are unresolved questions about the implementation of braking systems and the overall design of the energy generation mechanism.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those involved in mining operations, renewable energy projects, mechanical engineering, and energy efficiency solutions.

  • #31
mfb said:
No, each cart is responsible for 1/16 of that value. You don't have to care about the number of carts if the amount of mass lowered at the same time is constant.

But there will be 16 carts full of 69.44kg of ore all moving down at any 1 time. So the amount of mass being lowered will be 1111.04kg per meter per second.
 
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  • #32
mfb said:
What has to be more? You worked out the 13.6kW we had all the time.

No, each cart is responsible for 1/16 of that value. You don't have to care about the number of carts if the amount of mass lowered at the same time is constant.

I have no idea where this 1RPM comes from, but it is wrong. Your generator needs something like 15kW as design power (a bit more is fine, a bit less is also fine if you can use the brakes), the design rotation speed depends on the mechanism between monorail and generator.

You should roughly match the designed power (or at least don't be above it) and be in the right RPM range (not above the specifications) at the same time.

You will need the brakes for when there is no load on the generator, of course. There may well be a problem with speed regulation as the alternator will need to be run within fairly tight limits and it will not be 'convenient' to regulate the speed of the rock carrying to fit in with the electrical demands.

I am rapidly coming to the conclusion that a diesel generating set is the right answer for this application. Off the shelf, a known cost and can be sold afterwards. A number of small petrol generators could be even more practical. A bit of lighting and a TV would easily be fed from a 1kW set from a DIY / tool store.
 
  • #33
Sorry I should have said, the residence block has 1500 people living in it. The site is supplied by mains electricity although lately this has been off more than it has been on. Typically we see cuts regularly through the day but they are short. On a night it is possible to have no mains supply at all.

When the power stops to site we stay running for about 30 minutes through the UPS type thing they have.

Essential processes are powered by generators because that makes money. Workers are left in the dark as we don't matter. We had a generator of our own, probably like the one you are mentioning. It got very difficult though when the supervisors had power and the workers didn't. We took the decision to use it as a sort of emergency light system.

We are now in a kind of all or nothing scenario where either everyone has power or no-one does.
 
  • #34
danny.mcshane said:
But there will be 16 carts full of 69.44kg of ore all moving down at any 1 time. So the amount of mass being lowered will be 1111.04kg per meter per second.
No, and I have no idea how you combined your numbers to get that value.
250 tons/hour over 20m is 5000 tons*meters/hour, or 1389kg*meter/second.
 

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