Euler-Lagrange equation (EOM) solutions - hairy lagrangian

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the application of the Euler-Lagrange equation to a specific Lagrangian related to relativistic strings, as explored in Zwiebach's work. Participants are attempting to derive equations of motion and analyze the implications of their chosen Lagrangian, which includes complex dependencies on variables such as z and theta.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents their equation of motion derived from a Lagrangian, expressing difficulty in simplifying the resulting expression and identifying a specific solution.
  • Another participant questions the origin and meaning of the presented Lagrangian, seeking clarification on its derivation from Zwiebach.
  • A participant describes the context of their work within the framework of AdS5 x S5, detailing the induced metric and the ansatz used for string coordinates.
  • There are suggestions to verify the correctness of the derived equations by substituting potential solutions back into the Euler-Lagrange equation.
  • Some participants propose using computational tools like Maple or Mathematica to assist in solving the equations.
  • A later reply hints at revisiting a specific term in the derived equation, suggesting that it may hold the key to resolving the participant's confusion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various viewpoints on the derivation and implications of the equations, with no consensus reached on the correctness of the approaches or the solutions proposed. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specific solution to the Euler-Lagrange equation.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the complexity of the derived expressions and the potential for missing assumptions or steps in the mathematical reasoning. There is also mention of dependencies on specific definitions and the context of the problem being addressed.

Emil
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I'm going through Zwiebach Chapter 6 on relativistic strings to try to solve a
similar problem. I got all the way to my equation of motion
\begin{eqnarray*}
\delta S & = & [ p' \delta \theta]_{z 0}^{z 1} + \int_{z 0}^{z 1} d z \left(
p - \frac{\partial ( p')}{\partial z} \right) \delta \theta\\
& & \\
\Longrightarrow p - \frac{\partial ( p')}{\partial z} & = & 0\\
& & \\
{where} : & & \\
p & = & \frac{\partial L ( z, \theta, \theta')}{\partial \theta}\\
p' & = & \frac{\partial L ( z, \theta, \theta')}{\partial \theta'}
\end{eqnarray*}
The Lagrangian I have is \begin{array}{lll}
L ( z, \theta, \theta') & = & \frac{\cos^3 \theta}{z^5} \sqrt{1 + z^2
\theta'^2}
\end{array}, and I know that this equation is the Euler Lagrange equation.\begin{eqnarray*}
\frac{\partial L}{\partial \theta} - \frac{\partial}{\partial z} \left(
\frac{\partial L}{\partial \theta'} \right) & = & 0\\
& & \\
{where} : & & \\
\theta' ( z) & = & \frac{\partial \theta ( z)}{\partial z}\\
L ( z, \theta, \theta') & = & \frac{\cos^3 \theta}{z^5} \sqrt{1 + z^2
\theta'^2}
\end{eqnarray*}
Just putting the expression for L into the equation gives me a mess:
\begin{array}{lll}
\frac{- 3 \sin \theta \cos^2 \theta}{z^5} \sqrt{1 + z^2 \theta'^2} -
\frac{\sqrt{2} \theta'' ( 2 \theta'^2 z^2 + 3) \cos^3 \theta}{z^4 (
\theta'^2 z^2 + 2)^{3 / 2}} & = & 0
\end{array}
I don't think I'm supposed to brute force this. I know what I want is to show that
$$\theta = \arcsin ( z)$$ but I can't see how to get it. I'm thinking that there is something I'm missing about the equation of motion.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
oh and here is a link to the same question I posted on stackexchange
 
What is the meaning of that Lagrangian?
Or in other words, where in Zwiebach did you get it?
 
Well I'm working in $$A d S_5 \times S^5$$
\begin{eqnarray*}
- d s^2 & = & g_{\alpha \beta}^{{induced}} d X^{\mu} d X_{\mu}\\
& & \\
& = & \{ G_{\mu \nu} \partial_{\alpha} X^{\mu} \partial_{\beta} X^{\nu} \}
d X^{\mu} d X_{\mu}\\
& & \\
& = & \frac{1}{z^2} ( - d t^2 + d \vec{x}^2 + d z^2) + d \theta + \cos^2
\theta d \Omega_3^2 + \sin^2 \theta d \psi^2
\end{eqnarray*}
\begin{eqnarray*}
{spacetime} {indicies} : & \mu, \nu & \{ d = 0 \ldots 9 \}\\
{world} {brane} {indicies} : & \alpha_1, \alpha_2, \alpha_3 &
\{ p = 0 \ldots 7 \}\\
{spatial} {indicies} {on} {brane} : & i, j & \{ p = 0
\ldots 7 \}\\
{spatial} {indicies} {normal} {to} {brane} : & a, b
& \{ ( p - 1) \ldots d \}\\
{generic} {index} {for} {transverse} {coordinates}
: & & I \longrightarrow ( i, a)
\end{eqnarray*}
and we have:
\begin{eqnarray*}
\mu = 0 & t & \\
1 & x^1 & \\
2 & x^2 & \\
3 & x^3 & \\
4 & z & \\
5 & \alpha 1 & \\
6 & \alpha 2 & \\
7 & \alpha 3 & \\
8 & \theta & \\
9 & \psi &
\end{eqnarray*}
working in the static gauge so instead of $\begin{array}{ll}
\mu, \nu & \{ d = 0 \ldots 9 \}
\end{array}$we have $$\mu = 0 \ldots 7$$. I do a lot of ansatzing
\begin{eqnarray*}
'' {string} {coordinate}'' & : & X^8 ( x_1 \ldots x_7) \Rightarrow
{ansatz} \Rightarrow X^8 \left( \not{t}, \not{\vec{x}}, z,
\not{\alpha_1}, \not{\alpha_2}, \not{\alpha_3} \right) = \theta \left(
\not{t}, \not{\vec{x}}, z, \not{\alpha_1}, \not{\alpha_2}, \not{\alpha_3}
\right) = \theta ( z)\\
& & X^9 ( x_1 \ldots x_7) \Rightarrow {ansatz} \Rightarrow X^9 \left(
\not{t}, \not{\vec{x}}, z, \not{\alpha_1}, \not{\alpha_2}, \not{\alpha_3}
\right) = \psi \left( \not{t}, \not{\vec{x}}, z, \not{\alpha_1},
\not{\alpha_2}, \not{\alpha_3} \right) = \psi ( z)\\
& & {ansatz} : \psi ( z) = 0
\end{eqnarray*}
\begin{eqnarray*}
g_{\alpha \beta}^{{induced}} & = & g_{{Emil}} + G_{8 8}
\partial_{\alpha} X^8 \partial_{\beta} X^8 + G_{99} \partial_{\alpha} X^9
\partial_{\beta} X^9\\
& & \\
& = & \left(\begin{array}{cccccccc}
G_{00} & 0 & & & & & & 0\\
0 & G_{11} & 0 & & & & & \\
& 0 & G_{22} & 0 & & & & \\
& & 0 & G_{33} & 0 & & & \\
& & & 0 & G_{44} + G_{88} \left( \frac{\partial \theta}{\partial z}
\right)^2 & 0 & & \\
& & & & 0 & G_{55} & 0 & \\
& & & & & 0 & G_{66} & 0\\
0 & & & & & & 0 & G_{77}
\end{array}\right)\\
& & \\
& = & \left(\begin{array}{cccccccc}
\frac{1}{x_4^2} & & & & & & \ldots & 0\\
& \frac{1}{x_4^2} & & & & & & \vdots\\
& & \frac{1}{x_4^2} & & & & & \\
& & & \frac{1}{x_4^2} & & & & \\
& & & & \frac{1}{x_4^2} + 1 \left( \frac{\partial \theta}{\partial z}
\right)^2 & & & \\
& & & & & \cos^2 x_8 & & \\
\vdots & & & & & & \cos^2 x_8 \sin^2 x_5 & \\
0 & \ldots & & & & & & \cos^2 x_8 \sin^2 x_5 \sin^2 x_6
\end{array}\right)
\end{eqnarray*}
where I know that
\begin{eqnarray*}
L & = & \det \sqrt{g_{\alpha \beta}^{{induced}}}\\
& & \\
L & = & \frac{\cos^3 \theta}{z^5} \sqrt{1 + z^2 \left( \frac{\partial
\theta}{\partial z} \right)^2} = L ( z, \theta, \theta')
\end{eqnarray*}The action ends up working as follows:
\begin{eqnarray*}
S & = & \int d x_4 L ( X^8 ( x_1 \ldots x_7), X^9 ( x_1 \ldots x_7))\\
& & \\
S & = & \int d z L ( \theta ( t \ldots \alpha_3), \psi ( t \ldots
\alpha_3))\\
& & \\
& \Rightarrow & {ansatz} !\\
& & \\
S & = & \int d z L ( \theta ( z), 0) = \int d z \frac{\cos^3 \theta}{z^5}
\sqrt{1 + z^2 \left( \frac{\partial \theta}{\partial z} \right)^2}
\end{eqnarray*}
where I want to apply the principle of least action.
 
Sorry I don't think I can help..
However to check whether you did it right or wrong, I'd say to try and insert your solution to the Euler Lagrange equation you derived and check whether it's correct or not. In fact I don't see where the [itex]\sin ^2 x_5 \sin x_6[/itex] coming from your [itex]det \sqrt{g_{ab}}[/itex] went...
you could as well try computational method?
 
This could be done with maple or mathematica.
 
Take another look at the second term of the "mess" ;-) .
 

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