Evolution of Complexity: Can Organisms Develop Immunity to Drugs Over Time?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the evolution of complexity in organisms, particularly whether organisms inevitably become more complex over time and how environmental factors influence this process. Participants explore various theories, models, and hypotheses related to evolutionary biology, including the emergence of multicellular organisms from unicellular ancestors and the implications of environmental niches.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that organisms become more complex over time, while others argue that complexity is not guaranteed and depends on environmental conditions.
  • A viewpoint suggests that an ever-changing environment, combined with time, could lead to increased complexity in organisms.
  • It is noted that adaptability to the environment plays a crucial role in which species survive and evolve, rather than chance alone.
  • One participant highlights that the majority of living organisms today are bacteria, suggesting that mammalian evolution is a minor fluctuation in the broader context of life.
  • There is a discussion about the "Cambrian explosion" and whether the filling of niches by simpler organisms allowed for the rise of more complex organisms.
  • Some participants speculate that complexity may arise if the conditions are right, though they express uncertainty about what those conditions would be.
  • A participant describes potential pathways for unicellular organisms to evolve into multicellular ones, emphasizing the role of cooperation and specialization among cells.
  • Another participant references Gould's ideas about evolutionary paths, suggesting that not all organisms will necessarily evolve into more complex forms.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether complexity is an inevitable outcome of evolution. Multiple competing views remain regarding the role of environmental factors, adaptability, and the nature of evolutionary pathways.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the specific conditions necessary for complexity to arise and acknowledge that the evolutionary process is influenced by many factors, including environmental changes and chance events.

  • #31
Wouldn't immunity be another way to become more complex?
 
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  • #32
Gold Barz said:
Thats my point, I think given enough time you will see an increase in maximum complexity of atleast one kind of life, if not more, don't you agree?

Yep, I think we all agree that complexity can increase over time...I think we're just being careful not to imply that a certain degree of complexity (or a certain direction) is a necessary outcome or that all life will do this (since most life is still less "complex").

misskitty said:
Wouldn't immunity be another way to become more complex?

Certainly. Competition with other species, particularly species that directly attack you, is a great way to ramp up natural selection. Not that N.S. creates complexity...rather it can more quickly sort through the existing variations of a population and bring better-adapted (e.g., better immunity) traits to the forefront of the population.
 
  • #33
Phobos said:
Yep, I think we all agree that complexity can increase over time...I think we're just being careful not to imply that a certain degree of complexity (or a certain direction) is a necessary outcome or that all life will do this (since most life is still less "complex").

I sincerely think that complexity probably/likely increases over time. But the number of more complex life will narrow while it's complexity increases, don't you think?
 
  • #34
Phobos said:
Certainly. Competition with other species, particularly species that directly attack you, is a great way to ramp up natural selection. Not that N.S. creates complexity...rather it can more quickly sort through the existing variations of a population and bring better-adapted (e.g., better immunity) traits to the forefront of the population.

I know that there are certain strains of viruses or illnesses that the human race has become immune to...or most of it. That would mean that the human race continues to grow in complexity, wouldn't it?
 
  • #35
Gold Barz said:
I sincerely think that complexity probably/likely increases over time. But the number of more complex life will narrow while it's complexity increases, don't you think?

Maybe. There will porbably always be a spectrum of least to most complex. It might narrow a little bit. I can't see it narrowing by much though.
 
  • #36
This is related to the immunity I was talking about. Would it be possible for a person to develop and immunity to a drug? For example, a person undergoing chemotherapy becomes immune to the chemo so it stops working. How long would that take to happen?
 

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