Explain this trending science DIY video

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the mechanics and principles behind a DIY science video demonstrating a magnetic assembly that moves within a solenoid. Participants explore the behavior of magnets and electric circuits, particularly focusing on the interaction between the magnetic fields of the solenoid and the magnets, as well as the implications of flipping the orientation of the components.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the magnets complete an electric circuit with the battery and coil, forming a solenoid that produces a magnetic field which influences the movement of the assembly.
  • Others argue that the magnetic field strength of the solenoid is primarily determined by the current and the number of turns, suggesting that it remains relatively constant.
  • There is a discussion about the effects of flipping the entire assembly versus just the magnets, with some suggesting that flipping only the magnets would lead to a different interaction with the solenoid's field.
  • Participants note that if the solenoid is powered uniformly, it may not exert a net force on the magnets, potentially preventing movement.
  • Some express uncertainty about the terminology for the device, suggesting it could be a form of a permanent magnet linear motor, but no consensus is reached on a definitive name.
  • There is a shared appreciation for the creativity and novelty of the demonstration, with some participants reflecting on the simplicity of the components used.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the basic principles of magnetic interaction and circuit behavior, but there are multiple competing views regarding the effects of component orientation and the implications for movement. The discussion remains unresolved on several technical points.

Contextual Notes

Some limitations include assumptions about the uniformity of the magnetic field and the specific conditions under which the assembly operates, which are not fully explored or defined in the discussion.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those exploring concepts in electromagnetism, DIY science projects, or the principles of magnetic fields and forces in experimental setups.

I_am_learning
Messages
681
Reaction score
16

My take is:
The magnets are conductive and complete an electric circuit composed of the battery and a section of the coil (toroid) thereby forming a solenoid. The battery-magnet assembly is in the center of the solenoid. The magnetic field of the solenoid is maximum at the center and decreases towards the end. Move further away from the ends and the field decreases even faster.
The north and south poles of the magnet is oriented so that the magnetic field of solenoid and of the magnets are oppositely oriented, and the solenoid field will tend to push the magnets away from the center. And hence the assembly moves away. Repeat.

If the assembly is flipped over, it will still work, because the battery polarity will also be reversed and the solenoid will produce magnetic field in the other direction. However, if only the magnets are flipped over the battery, then I think the assembly will tend to be stuck at the center. Also, instead of flipping the magnet, if a different toroid, where the wire is wound the other way is used, it will fail.

Am I right?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Well, the magnetic field strength of the solenoid (B) depends on the current of the circuit (constant) the number of turns. The number of turns is the number of turns between the plus and minus, so that is pretty much constant through the whole, so I don't think that the field strength will change very much.

For your second question, yes it would work the same way if the whole assembly was reversed, the solenoid N will become S, and the Magnets N will become S as well.

But if just the magnets are flipped around, then the solenoid will remain the same (battery isn't flipped), but the magnets will be the same, so it wouldn't just be stuck in the middle, the solenoid would repel it outward as soon as both magnets touch the coil.

The polarity isn't affected by wether the wire is wound clockwise or counterclockwise, only which end is connected to positive and which to negative, so if just the solenoid is flipped around, the train would work the same.

Please somebody correct me if I am wrong.
 
PRIDES said:
Well, the magnetic field strength of the solenoid (B) depends on the current of the circuit (constant) the number of turns. The number of turns is the number of turns between the plus and minus, so that is pretty much constant through the whole, so I don't think that the field strength will change very much.
I agree on that.
But, when I talked about field strength decreasing, I was actually talking about the magnetic field distribution of a solenoid, at any given instant, formed around the battery-magnet assembly. I was trying to make the point that, since the magnetic field is non-uniform the magnet-assembly CAN have a net force. If whole of the toroid was powered by external power supply, thereby creating a near-uniform magnetic filed throughout, I think there will be no net force on the magnets, and hence it won't move.
PRIDES said:
But if just the magnets are flipped around, then the solenoid will remain the same (battery isn't flipped), but the magnets will be the same, so it wouldn't just be stuck in the middle, the solenoid would repel it outward as soon as both magnets touch the coil.
In that case, the magnetic fields of the instantaneous solenoid and the magnets would be facing the same way, and hence will tend to pull each-other not push.

PRIDES said:
The polarity isn't affected by wether the wire is wound clockwise or counterclockwise, only which end is connected to positive and which to negative, so if just the solenoid is flipped around, the train would work the same.
The direction of magnetic field produced by a coil depends upon the winding direction of the coils.
 
I_am_learning said:
I agree on that.
But, when I talked about field strength decreasing, I was actually talking about the magnetic field distribution of a solenoid, at any given instant, formed around the battery-magnet assembly. I was trying to make the point that, since the magnetic field is non-uniform the magnet-assembly CAN have a net force. If whole of the toroid was powered by external power supply, thereby creating a near-uniform magnetic filed throughout, I think there will be no net force on the magnets, and hence it won't move.
In that case, the magnetic fields of the instantaneous solenoid and the magnets would be facing the same way, and hence will tend to pull each-other not push.The direction of magnetic field produced by a coil depends upon the winding direction of the coils.

Oh yes, the rotational direction of the current you are correct. Solenoids ARE different from electromagnets in that respect, oops, my bad.
I'll also need to remind myself that a coil simply turned around is still wound the same way as well, which isn't the same as reversing the winding.

I initially thought that the magnets were oriented to the solenoid, however I was wrong about that too, if that was the case they would be attracted to the center, so you are right they would be stuck in the middle if the magnets were flipped.

I better check myself before I wreck myself.
 
Nobody yet mentioned how cool that demo is! Why aren't they in the shops right now?
 
sophiecentaur said:
Nobody yet mentioned how cool that demo is! Why aren't they in the shops right now?
Finally someone to appreciate its coolness. :). I had played a lot with wires, and magnets, but it never occurred to me that you could make such a cool thing with just those basic ingredients. I think somebody just doesn't first imagine they are going to make this and then make, rather I believe, these things are accidentally discovered.
BTW, what do we call this thing? Its certainly not a coil gun, not a rail gun (although quite near), not a magnetic train, not a motor. Maybe, its some form of permanent magnet linear motor?
The fact that the power source is traveling makes it distinct from other elementary electromagnetic motion system, I think.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 27 ·
Replies
27
Views
4K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
5K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
4K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
5K
  • · Replies 36 ·
2
Replies
36
Views
6K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
6K