Explicit expression for ideal membership

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    Explicit Expression
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around deriving an explicit expression for elements within the ideal generated by a polynomial in the context of polynomials over the rational numbers. Participants explore definitions, examples, and potential formulas related to membership in such ideals.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks to derive an explicit expression for all polynomials in the ideal generated by a polynomial ##q(x)##, questioning if a published formula exists.
  • Another participant requests clarification on the definition of the ideal ##\langle q \rangle##, which is defined as the set of all polynomials of the form ##q(x)h(x)## where ##h(x)## is also a polynomial in ##\mathbb{Q}[x]##.
  • A participant provides an example illustrating the ideal generated by ##x-1## and proposes a specific form for polynomials in that ideal, suggesting a potential generalization for other cases.
  • Another participant critiques the necessity of the previously mentioned formula regarding the sum of coefficients, instead describing the form of polynomials in the ideal generated by a polynomial of degree ##k##.
  • This participant also mentions polynomial division as a method to verify if a given polynomial belongs to the ideal.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

The discussion contains multiple viewpoints regarding the derivation of explicit expressions and the necessity of certain formulas. No consensus is reached on the existence of a general formula applicable to all cases.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the general case of deriving explicit expressions for polynomials in ideals, particularly regarding the conditions on degrees of the polynomials involved.

aheight
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TL;DR
Construct an explicit expression for all elements in an ideal of Q[x]?
Derive an explicit expression for all ##f\in\langle q\rangle\subseteq \mathbb{Q}[x]##. I think it's doable and was wondering if there is a published formula?
 
Last edited:
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What is the definition of ##\left<q\right>##?
 
Office_Shredder said:
What is the definition of ##\left<q\right>##?
##\langle q \rangle## is the Ideal generated by the polynomial ##q(x)\in \mathbb{Q}[x]##.

$$
\langle q\rangle=\{q(x)h(x): h(x)\in \mathbb{Q}[x]\}.
$$

For example ##x^6-1\in \langle x-1\rangle##. And in this case, it's easy to derive an explicit expression for all ##a_0+a_1x+\cdots+a_n x^n\in\langle x-1\rangle## right? It's ##\{a_0+a_1 x+\cdots+a_nx^2\in \mathbb{Q}[x]:\sum a_i=0\}##. So I was wondering if there is a known formula for the general case:
$$
a_0+a_1x+\cdots+a_n x^n\in\langle b_0+b_1x+\cdots+ b_n x^k\rangle
$$
say for ##k<n## or maybe any ##k,n##. Not sure though.
 
Last edited:
That formula about the sum of coefficients is a slightly neat trick but unnecessary.

The polynomials in ##<b_kx^k+...+b_0>## are the ones of the form ##b_k a_n x^{k+n}+ (b_{k-1} a_n + b_k a_{n-1}) x^{k+n-1}+...##

If you're wondering given a polynomial how you can check if it's in the right form, that's also easy. Polynomial division is a straightforward algorithm that you can perform to see if your polynomial is dividing.
 

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