Dismiss Notice
Join Physics Forums Today!
The friendliest, high quality science and math community on the planet! Everyone who loves science is here!

Falsified Resume Forces Resignation of MIT Dean

  1. May 1, 2007 #21

    russ_watters

    User Avatar

    Staff: Mentor

    'Competition is stressful, so I lied'? You can't be serious!?! And now she's writing a book essentially trying to justify her cheating? That's a joke. What kind of message does that send?

    I would think that MIT would expel a student if they found out he/she falsified a high school transcript, yes.

    Fair, appropriate accountability in a situation like this is to not allow someone to be rewarded for cheating. You guys are missing the point about performance: It doesn't matter that she was good at her job, in a competitive environment, odds are a bunch of people who applied would have been near-equally as good and perhaps even better. She got something she didn't deserve by lying. That's pretty much the definition of fraud. If people do that in sports, they get stripped of their accomplishments because it renders the accomplishments meaningless.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2007
  2. May 1, 2007 #22

    Moonbear

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor
    Gold Member

    Actually, MIT probably has no choice than to fire her and sue her for back pay. If they didn't, then every other job applicant who was rejected for not having those credentials, or every employee who is receiving lower pay scales for the same or better credentials (actual, not faked) could sue them for not receiving fair wages. When certain positions and pay scales are based on degrees, and you don't have those degrees, then yes, they should be reimbursed for it.
     
  3. May 1, 2007 #23

    Evo

    User Avatar

    Staff: Mentor

    In her case though, she wasn't promoted to Dean based on the ancient degrees, but on her actual performance. The problem is that the old degrees were still on her resume because she was afraid if she deleted them it would raise questions. Remember the old saying "Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive". MIT can't bend the rules for her because they would be obligated to bend them for everyone. And you're probably right that in an educational environment salary is probably commensurate with degrees, even if those degrees were from 40 years ago.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2007
  4. May 1, 2007 #24

    Moonbear

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor
    Gold Member

    Dean searches always require specified degrees plus experience. If she didn't have the degree, she should have never been considered for the position in the first place. That is a pretty big deal, especially for whoever was the "second runner up" in that search who did not get the job. People don't just get "promoted" to Dean. A search is always conducted, she probably just applied as an internal candidate. Hmm...I haven't been asked to provide a transcript for any position since my post-doc days, so I wonder if universities will start requiring those again for all applicants in the aftermath of this incident.

    This would be considered a major breach of academic integrity to have falsified her CV and degrees earned to obtain a job. If she was so embarrassed by her past, perhaps she should not have applied for the dean's position in the first place.
     
  5. May 1, 2007 #25

    Mk

    User Avatar

    I'm not sure what I think about this one. Maybe I'm with the minority that thinks it is ok. I despise credentialism, although it may be an easier way to pick good people out of a massive group (assuming no body had to lie). But it also doesn't seem right that she did that. That's lying on your resume, academic or not.
     
  6. May 1, 2007 #26
    Agreed and for the reason you gave.
    I don't see this part.
     
  7. May 1, 2007 #27
    The issue is that she lied on her resume. If she had told the truth on her resume, and still was promoted, and then it came out that the promotion was inappropriate, surely the outcome would have been much different.
     
  8. May 1, 2007 #28
    You obviously arent fit for living in a big city. :smile: Man if you get stressed like that at traffic you are going to die young.
     
  9. May 1, 2007 #29

    edward

    User Avatar
    Gold Member

    It seems like lately people are using entirely fake diplomas.

    http://www.gcn.com/online/vol1_no1/22294-1.html [Broken]


    edit:
    In some cases the federal government had picked up the tab for fake degrees.

    http://www.washingtontechnology.com/online/1_1/23510-1.html [Broken]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 2, 2017
  10. May 1, 2007 #30

    Astronuc

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor

    :rofl: I wonder if Callahan ever set foot in Wyoming - or did she do course work by mail or on-line?

    :yuck:
     
  11. May 1, 2007 #31

    edward

    User Avatar
    Gold Member

    Diploma mills are all over the net. This one "stands behind their work":bugeye:

    http://www.diplomasandtranscripts.com/
     
  12. May 1, 2007 #32

    It says "The ONLY novelty diploma site with a MONEY BACK GUARANTEE!!"

    Excellent. If the diploma is not real novelty you can get a refund!

    EDIT: ...unless it's a novelty guarantee of course.

    EDIT2: Do you suppose they accept novelty money?
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2007
  13. May 1, 2007 #33

    cronxeh

    User Avatar
    Gold Member

    Like russ said her accomplishments are meaningless, and as far as I know if you lied on a federal, state, or city application or misrepresented yourself in any way - that is a felony. http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/261747_diplomamill04.html" [Broken]People not only lose their jobs they go to jail. This is not just about some liberal touchy-feely 'aww she bent the truth let her go' crap. This is about a high school grad who was called a DR for nearly 3 decades and put on this facade of competency. Imagine you are a college student who pays 30 grand in tuition every year (wait a minute.. that sounds like an MIT student). Now you go to classes in hopes of attaining a high quality education. How would you feel if your professor was just a god damned high school graduate? At least she graduated from high school, maybe.

    I am outraged that not nearly as many of you supposedly rational people are outraged as much as I am.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 2, 2017
  14. May 1, 2007 #34

    Astronuc

    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Science Advisor

    I save outrage for the tremendous loss of life in the Iraq War, and the dishonesty and harmful policies of the Bush administration, and the legendary corruption of the Republican controlled 109th Congress. Where's the outrage there? Jones is small potatoes in comparison.

    Jones was wrong - no one has argued otherwise. On the other hand, despite the lack of integrity in this matter, it does appear that she is quite competent in her work.
     
  15. May 1, 2007 #35

    Evo

    User Avatar

    Staff: Mentor

    Honestly, I look for competence, not degrees. Lots of incompetant people out there with degrees including PHD's. Lots of crackpots with PHD's.

    She was obviously competent, probably the best MIT ever had. That doesn't excuse lying on her resume, but it is definite proof that having a degree or the lack of a degree is not an indication of competency. Don't get the two confused.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 2, 2017
  16. May 1, 2007 #36

    cronxeh

    User Avatar
    Gold Member

    The government is incompetent, the President is a fraud, and the war costs 240 million a day. We know this, and people are used to the greed of stupid people. But this is MIT. This is supposed to be the beacon of hope amids of all the ignorance in this country. This is our future, our children's future and perhaps future of the entire human race depends on those higher education institutions that would find the cure for cancer, find a way to create controlled fusion, develop better materials, find solutions to problems in science and engineering. If we let this go now it will never be the same again. It would be a collapse of integrity in the highest of standards.


    But then again, you saw what happens when someone who doesnt deserve the job gets it - just read this post over.
     
  17. May 1, 2007 #37

    Evo

    User Avatar

    Staff: Mentor

    Yeah, MIT got the most outstanding Dean of Admissions in the school's history.

    Truth is cronxeh, a degree means nothing as far as capabilities are concerned. Hate to fall back to the "Einstein" thing, but he only had an undergraduate degree and wasn't anywhere near the top of the class. But he had an extrordinary mind, just becuase he didn't excel in school or go on to get a higher education means nothing.
     
  18. May 1, 2007 #38

    edward

    User Avatar
    Gold Member

    Apparently being an advisor to the president and one who appears to set national policy doesn't require a degree of any kind. And yet Karl Rove has made quite a splash in D.C.:eek:
     
  19. May 1, 2007 #39

    cronxeh

    User Avatar
    Gold Member


    He didnt lie and tell everyone he was a genius to get the chicks in bed. And as far as this Dean is concerned, her work can be seen in the male:female ratio - MIT is famous for having 50%-50% of ratio, compare that to my Uni where there were only 18% females or Caltech where its 28%. Most tech schools have low male to female ratio, but oh wait here comes MIT - an anamoly of sorts, or should I say a forced evolutionary change where the undeserving get the spots over those who are eligible by merit. I'm not being sexist but perhaps she is? What an odd scenario : a high school grad who couldnt cut it in RPI is a Dean of Admission who levels the field by making it 50-50 for other females. Gee, thats odd, sounds like a good movie script or a summary of a deposition.

    Oh wait I have a graph http://www-tech.mit.edu/V127/N14/admissions/table.html

    2005-2006:
    7608 males applied, 10% admitted: 758. Number DENIED: 6850
    2832 females applied, 26% admitteD: 736. Number DENIED: 2096

    2004-2005:
    7669 males applied, 11.7% admitted: 898. Number DENIED: 6771
    2797 females applied, 27.4% admitted: 767. Number DENIED: 2030

    2003-2004:
    7651 males applied, 11.6% admitted: 885. Number DENIED: 6766
    2898 females applied, 29.3% admitted: 850. Number DENIED: 2048

    Thats roughly 20387 males rejected in a 3 year period, give or take those who reapplied. Doesnt it strike you odd that twice as many females were admitted than males? Sounds like a sexual discrimination with a motive.


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marilee_Jones :
    A spokesperson from Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute reported on April 26, 2007 that Jones attended the institute as a "part-time, non- matriculating student" from September 1974 to June 1975 and did not receive a degree.[9] Spokespeople from Union College and from Albany Medical College both reported that there are no records of Jones ever attending either institution.[9] The same day, MIT confirmed that Jones did not hold a bachelor's degree from any institution.[10]

    Wait did i get this right? She was there for Fall 74 and Spring 75 - thats 2 semesters, and part time means 6 credits but less than 12.. so thats 12-20 credits that she earned? Or maybe got a D? Thats 3-4 classes at most!! This chick is an even bigger fraud than GW Bush - at least he actually went to Harvard.

    Hey Evo, how is this for rant: Go to Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute today, take English101, Biology101, Chemistry101 and you can be a Dean of Admissions for a major private University! Make 170 grand a year and get to ruin lives of thousands of those nerds who used to be better than you in High School and College! Yeaah!
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2007
  20. May 1, 2007 #40
    Ideally schools should require a degree because a degree helps you do your work better. Not because it will look better on you. However putting a premium on authenticity seems a long standing american tradition.
     
Share this great discussion with others via Reddit, Google+, Twitter, or Facebook