Feynman's third general principle of QM

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around Feynman's third general principle of quantum mechanics, specifically its implications and the reasoning behind the treatment of amplitude and phase in quantum mechanics. Participants explore the foundational aspects of quantum mechanics as presented in Feynman's lectures, focusing on the mathematical formulation of amplitudes in the context of the double slit experiment.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the validity of dropping the phase term in the amplitude calculation, suggesting that it is significant for the total amplitude.
  • Another participant asserts that the principle is an axiom and cannot be questioned, emphasizing that it leads to the desired results in quantum mechanics.
  • A different viewpoint suggests that Feynman does not treat this principle as an axiom and proposes that the phase could be absorbed into the amplitudes involved.
  • One participant agrees that the phase might be absorbed but introduces a more complex example involving multiple points, indicating potential inconsistencies in Feynman's presentation.
  • There is a request for clarification on Feynman's complete set of principles of quantum mechanics.
  • Another participant notes that Feynman's principles are not intended as a rigorous axiomatic framework but rather as introductory concepts for lectures.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether Feynman's principle should be considered an axiom and the implications of phase in quantum amplitudes. There is no consensus on the treatment of the phase term or the completeness of Feynman's principles.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge that Feynman's principles were designed for educational purposes and may lack the rigor of a formal axiomatic approach to quantum mechanics. This context may influence the interpretation and application of the principles discussed.

ralqs
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I'm reading vol. 3 of the Feynman lectures on physics, and in chapter three he describes his third general principle of quantum mechanics as follows:

"The third general principle: When a particle goes by some particular route the amplitude for that route can be written as the product of the amplitude to go part way with the amplitude to go the rest of the way. For the [double slit experiment] the amplitude to go from the [electron source, s] to [some point on the screen, x] by way of hole 1 is equal to the amplitude to go from s to 1, multiplied by the amplitude to go from 1 to x:
[tex]{\langle x | s \rangle}_{via 1} = \langle x | 1 \rangle \langle 1 | s \rangle[/tex]"

My question is, why is this true? Obviously, probabilities must multiply, so
[tex]|{\langle x | s \rangle}_{via 1}|^2 = |\langle x | 1 \rangle|^2 \langle 1 | s \rangle|^2[/tex]
meaning
[tex]{\langle x | s \rangle}_{via 1} = \langle x | 1 \rangle \langle 1 | s \rangle e^{i \vartheta}[/tex]

But why can we drop the theta term? It's clearly important, because if we want to total amplitude to go to x via s we will need to add
[tex]{\langle x | s\rangle}_{via 1} + {\langle x | s\rangle}_{via 2} = \langle x | s\rangle[/tex]

So what allows us to ignore the phase?
 
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My question is, why is this true?
It's an axiom. You can't ask why an axiom is true. The only possible answer is that it leads to the desired results.

Feynman is trying to explain the difference between classical and quantum mechanics in terms of a small set of principles. The fact that wavefunctions are complex and so we deal with complex probability amplitudes rather than probabilities themselves is what gives quantum mechanics its wavelike features.
 
Bill_K said:
It's an axiom.

My impression is that Feynman wasn't treating this as an axiom. In the first chapter of the volume, he seems to give all the axioms of quantum behavior. As I understand it, amplitudes are usually determined up to a phase constant...is it not possible that the phase here got absorbed into either [tex]\langle x|1 \rangle[/tex] or [tex]\langle 1|s \rangle[/tex]?
 
ralqs said:
s it not possible that the phase here got absorbed into either [itex]\langle x|1 \rangle[/itex] or [itex]\langle 1|s \rangle[/itex]?
Yes, but you may then take an example with two points on the way: [itex]\langle x|s \rangle =\langle x|1 \rangle\langle 1|s \rangle=\langle x|1 \rangle\langle 1|a \rangle\langle a|s \rangle[/itex]
Probably Feynman should make it as an axiom, but don't forget that this argumentation was created by him just to be used in a series of lectures, not as a new formal approach to QM, so (as it is too late to discuss it with Him) - forgive him a small inconsistency.
 
What are his complete set of principles of QM? Thanks.
 
Oh, his principles are not a quite serious axiomatic approach to QM... They was made just for the purpose of series of introductory lectures. So don't demand them to be complete and fully consistent.
Have a great reading with his book! That was the one I learned my basic QM from. And the one I still recommend to all students..
 

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