Do Free Electrons Decrease in a Conductor with Applied Voltage?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the behavior of free electrons in a conductor when an external electrical potential difference is applied. Participants explore whether the number of free electrons decreases and consider the implications of electron flow in both direct current (DC) and alternating current (AC) contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants argue that the number of free electrons does not decrease because electrons return, moving in a closed loop.
  • Others clarify that electrons flow from areas of high concentration to low concentration, and that the force acting on them is reduced as they perform work.
  • A distinction is made between AC and DC circuits, with participants noting that in AC, electrons move back and forth, while in DC, they move towards equilibrium until voltage is zero.
  • Concerns are raised about the clarity of the original question, with some participants suggesting it may be misleading regarding the direction of current and electron flow.
  • Some participants express uncertainty about the implications of the question, particularly regarding the measurement of current and the behavior of light bulbs in circuits.
  • A later reply discusses that while electrons are not lost, the force to move them can be removed, leading to a decrease in current flow over time in certain conditions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the clarity of the question or the implications of electron flow in conductors. Multiple competing views remain regarding the interpretation of current flow and the behavior of electrons in different circuit types.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in the original question's wording and the assumptions made about circuit behavior, particularly regarding the effects of voltage and current on electron movement.

gracy
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when the external electrical potential difference is applied across the conductor ,electrons flow in the direction opposite to the current.Whether the number of free electrons in the conductor decrease?
I think ,No.As electrons return ,because they move in closed loop.
 
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gracy said:
when the external electrical potential difference is applied across the conductor ,electrons flow in the direction opposite to the current.Whether the number of free electrons in the conductor decrease?
I think ,No.As electrons return ,because they move in closed loop.
your question is not clear, can you please restate it?
 
Electrons, like fluid, flow from an area of high concentration to low concentration. This is why we have electron current (essentially DC- to DC+ in a DC circuit) and conventional current (DC+ to DC-). You don't actually lose electrons per se; the force acting them is reduced as they perform work.

It would also help if you could clarify between whether you're referring to AC or DC. If it's AC the electrons continually move back and forth according to the electromagnetic force acting on the conductor, in DC the electrons will move from the high-concentration area to the lower-concentration area until equilibrium (zero voltage) is reached.
 
lonely_nucleus said:
your question is not clear, can you please restate it?
XZ923 said:
It would also help if you could clarify between whether you're referring to AC or DC
I have stated the question as it was given in my textbook.
 
gracy said:
I have stated the question as it was given in my textbook.
Then IMHO the textbook needs to be re-written. "electrons flow in the direction opposite to the current" is extremely misleading. Current is itself the movement of electrons. I think what the textbook may be driving it as the issue of conventional vs. electron current flow.
 
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XZ923 said:
I think what the textbook may be driving it as the issue of conventional vs. electron current flow.
Yes.
 
gracy said:
I think ,No
Am I right.
 
gracy said:
Am I right.
I honestly don't know because I'm not sure what exactly the question is. Is the direction of electron current the opposite of conventional current in a DC circuit? yes.
 
By convention, the direction of current is opposite to the direction of motion of electrons.

gracy said:
when the external electrical potential difference is applied across the conductor ,electrons flow in the direction opposite to the current.Whether the number of free electrons in the conductor decrease?
I think ,No.As electrons return ,because they move in closed loop.

Haven't you connected an ammeter to a circuit? What does an ammeter measure? And do you think if you sit there and look at the measured current long enough, the current drops over time, i.e the "free electrons in the conductor decreases"?

If this is a question from your textbook, it should have been done in the HW/Coursework forum, not here.

Zz.
 
  • #10
ZapperZ said:
Haven't you connected an ammeter to a circuit? What does an ammeter measure? And do you think if you sit there long enough, the current drops over time, i.e the "free electrons in the conductor decreases"?
All these information is not given .It was just a conceptual doubt.
 
  • #11
gracy said:
All these information is not given .It was just a conceptual doubt.

I thought they were out of your texbook?

Besides, haven't you done simple basic circuit already? Or haven't you looked at the light bulb in your house after you turned it on? Do you see it diminishing in brightness over a short period of time, which would be consistent with the circuit losing electrons?

What I'm trying to teach you here is to look around you and see if you can find the answer yourself. Just because physics is taught in a classroom in school, it doesn't mean that it has no connection to reality or the world around you. You need to ask yourself "If it is true that the circuit is losing electrons, then... " (i) you should expect the current to drop over time and (ii) things connected to it will start behaving in such a way as to exhibit this drop in current over time, and (ii) my lightbulb should start getting noticeably dimmer!

Zz.
 
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  • #12
ZapperZ said:
Do you see it diminishing in brightness over a short period of time
No.
 
  • #13
gracy said:
No.

Great!
 
  • #14
Thanks.
gracy said:
No.As electrons return ,because they move in closed loop.
Is it correct?
 
  • #15
gracy said:
Thanks.

Is it correct?
In as much as the question seems to be asking about losing electrons, yes. Like I said though the question isn't worded real well; in particular it doesn't take into account the circuit you're working with.

Let's use Zz's example of a light bulb's brightness. No, you will not see the bulb in your house get dim as you leave the light on because there's always a power source (the main feed to your home). However, if you take the same bulb and put it in a DC circuit, you WILL notice it steadily getting dimmer over time, with how much time being dependent on P=VI, where P=power in watts, V=voltage, and I=current flow (amperage) and then calculated against the battery's rating. Eventually the bulb will go out. However, this isn't because any electrons have been "lost", it's because there is no longer a force to move them. Voltage is a potential difference between two points. If you attach a DC power source (battery) to a load, the difference in electron concentration will cause the electrons to flow from a high concentration to low concentration. This will continue until they reach a point of equilibrium throughout the circuit, ie zero voltage. At that point there is no longer any force to move the electrons. They are still there; they're just not moving!

AC brings a different set of variables but the basic concept is the same; as long as there is a force to move the electrons you will have electric current until the force is removed. As such the electrons are not "lost" so much as they are moved through the conductor, but they remain in the circuit itself.
 
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