Frost on roof window melts in lines

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the phenomenon of frost melting in regular lines on a roof window. Participants explore potential causes, including the properties of the glass, environmental factors, and the influence of sunlight. The scope includes conceptual reasoning and exploratory hypotheses regarding the observed pattern.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the glass may be slightly wavy, leading to the observed melting pattern.
  • Another proposes that the manufacturing process of glass could leave slight differences in thickness, contributing to the lines.
  • A question is raised about whether the window is flat glass or a domed skylight, indicating a need for clarification on the type of glass.
  • Some participants speculate that streaks from running water could create preferential freezing patterns, although this is questioned as too regular for that explanation.
  • There is a hypothesis regarding the possibility of thermal convection cells forming due to a leak in the vacuum between the glass sheets, although this is met with skepticism.
  • One participant suggests that sunlight reflecting off a corrugated metal roof might be responsible for the pattern, but acknowledges the need for closer investigation.
  • Another participant mentions the potential influence of dirt on the window and its effect on the melting pattern.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the cause of the melting pattern, and the discussion remains unresolved with no consensus reached.

Contextual Notes

Some limitations include the lack of clarity on the type of glass and the specific environmental conditions during the observation. There are also unresolved questions about the influence of external factors such as sunlight and dirt on the window.

greypilgrim
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Hi.

On a cold morning, I saw frost melting on my roof window. Why did it melt in regular lines? Might the glass be slightly wavy?

IMG_20210414_090954.jpg
 
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Hm ... interesting. Glass sheets do go under rollers during the creation process so maybe one of the rollers left just the tiniest differences in thicknesses along the surface.
 
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Is that flat glass or a domed skylight (often plastic)?
phinds said:
Glass sheets do go under rollers during the creation process
Before float glass, 1960s?
 
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Glass. I assume plastic sheets are created the same way but do not know for sure.
 
Could there be streaks from water running down it? These might freeze preferentially.
 
Keith_McClary said:
Could there be streaks from water running down it? These might freeze preferentially.
Seems too regular for that
 
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Might it be that the vacuum between the glass is leak (is there an actual vacuum? Or just some special gas?) and you get these thermal convection cells? Maybe with some nice vertical vortex structures because of the slanted angle?
 
Arjan82 said:
(is there an actual vacuum?
No vacuum. The sheets would bend due to atmospheric pressure. There is a very modern design with very low pressure inside but it has stainless steel internal spacers. There was a posting about that on PF some while ago - not applicable here, I think.
It is a fascinating problem. I wonder if this is repeated on a daily basis and if it correlates with the windows being cleaned.
Could it be due to sunlight through bars on the roof or a similar effect due to an internal radiant heater? But it's a very fine pattern so perhaps not.
As usual, I suggest some experimentation. Stick a sheet of paper over half the window and see if the left and right sides still show the same pattern. If you can get to the upper glazing bar, try giving it a good (shiny) clean ( where you can't see); there could be some stripes of dirt / original packaging which dribble down the window. Examine the tiles above the window. Are they patterned?
 
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  • #10
My guess is that the pattern is formed by sunlight reflecting off a corrugated metal roof during cold weather.
 
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  • #11
Mister T said:
My guess is that the pattern is formed by sunlight reflecting off a corrugated metal roof during cold weather.
Not impossible but the pattern is very fine (in the scale of buildings) - the spacing would need to be less than a degree from a source tens of metres away.
If the effect were to be repeated often then the OP could investigate further.
 
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Thanks for all the replies! I observed this after an especially cold night, which are rare now that summer is coming. I might have to wait half a year for further investigation...

Keith_McClary said:
Could there be streaks from water running down it? These might freeze preferentially.
This might actually be a good point. There is dirt on the upper half of the window that I usually keep covered by the shutters with streaks from running water in it (hard to photograph against the sky). They are far less regular though.
 
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