Generalized Momentum is a linear functional of Velocity?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between generalized momentum and velocity within the context of Lagrangian mechanics, specifically examining whether generalized momentum can be considered a linear functional of velocity. The scope includes theoretical aspects of mechanics and mathematical formulations related to the tangent and cotangent bundles.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that generalized momentum is covariant while velocity is contravariant in coordinate transformations, suggesting a relationship between the two in the context of tangent and cotangent bundles.
  • One participant argues that if the Lagrangian is quadratic in coordinate velocities, then momentum can be expressed as a linear mapping through a generalized inertia tensor, represented mathematically as P_a = M_{ab}(Q,t)\dot{Q}^b.
  • Another participant reiterates the previous point about the quadratic nature of the Lagrangian and its implications for linearity at the tangent bundle.
  • There is a discussion about the contraction P_a\dot{Q}^a being a scalar, with one participant questioning the nature of this scalar as "real" and speculating about the possibility of complex inertia in Lagrangians.
  • One participant concludes that the contraction indeed maps \dot{Q} from the tangent bundle to the real number field as a functional, expressing satisfaction with this understanding.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of the contraction and its implications, particularly regarding whether it can be considered "real." The discussion does not reach a consensus on the broader implications of generalized momentum as a linear functional of velocity.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the nature of the Lagrangian and the conditions under which the inertia tensor may or may not depend on velocity. The discussion also touches on the implications of using complex numbers in the context of inertia, which remains speculative.

chmodfree
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Generalized momentum is covariant while velocity is contravariant in coordinate transformation on configuration space, thus they are defined in the tangent bundle and cotangent bundle respectively.
Question: Is that means the momentum is a linear functional of velocity? If so, the way to construct this functional?
 
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If the Lagrangian is quadratic in the coordinate velocities then it is linear at the point of the tangent bundle and can thus be expressed as the result of a linear mapping by a generalized inertia tensor, P_a = M_{ab}(Q,t)\dot{Q}^b

P_a = \frac{\partial \mathcal{L}(Q,\dot{Q},t)}{\partial \dot{Q}^a} = M_{ab}\dot{Q}^b with M not depending on any \dot{Q} if and only if the Lagrangian was quadratic in these velocities.
 
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jambaugh said:
If the Lagrangian is quadratic in the coordinate velocities then it is linear at the point of the tangent bundle and can thus be expressed as the result of a linear mapping by a generalized inertia tensor, P_a = M_{ab}(Q,t)\dot{Q}^b

P_a = \frac{\partial \mathcal{L}(Q,\dot{Q},t)}{\partial \dot{Q}^a} = M_{ab}\dot{Q}^b with M not depending on any \dot{Q} if and only if the Lagrangian was quadratic in these velocities.
Oh I see, that means the contraction P_a\dot{Q}^a is a real.
 
chmodfree said:
Oh I see, that means the contraction P_a\dot{Q}^a is a real.
I don't know about real... I imagine someone might cook up a Lagrangian with complex inertia, but the contraction is a scalar.
 
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jambaugh said:
I don't know about real... I imagine someone might cook up a Lagrangian with complex inertia, but the contraction is a scalar.
I mean it maps \dot{Q} from tangent bundle to the real number field as a functional... No problem now, thank you.
 

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