Has Humanity Achieved Spiritual Growth Over Millennia?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion explores the concept of spiritual growth in humanity over millennia, questioning whether humans have evolved spiritually or remain fundamentally unchanged in their behaviors such as warlikeness, egocentrism, and greed. It touches on philosophical perspectives, the nature of kindness, and the implications of societal constructs.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants reference Olaf Stapledon's works to frame the discussion about humanity's spiritual evolution and question if we have truly grown or if we remain unchanged in negative traits.
  • One participant argues that nature is indifferent and that concepts of kindness and spirituality are human inventions that serve social purposes.
  • Another participant suggests that societal advancements, such as laws and protections, indicate a form of progress in human civilization, though it remains unclear if this equates to spiritual growth.
  • There is a reiteration of the question regarding whether spiritual growth is part of a larger plan, with differing opinions on its significance and existence.
  • A participant expresses concern that the discussion may not align with established philosophical guidelines.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the existence and significance of spiritual growth, with no consensus reached on whether humanity has achieved any form of spiritual advancement or if such growth is even part of a broader plan.

Contextual Notes

Some arguments depend on subjective interpretations of nature and spirituality, and there are unresolved questions about the definitions of kindness and spiritual growth.

Tregg Smith
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Philosopher Olaf Stapledon wrote Starmaker and the First and Last Men; supposed to be the best of the best in science fiction or future history according to some authorities. The books cover a time span of a gazillion supereons in the evolution of life in the universe. Planets are born and die. Intelligent life develops as water and plant forms as well as mankind, then passes away and develops into other forms with different minds. I wonder if in our entire history we have grown spiritually at all or if we have not and are still just as warlike, egocentric, greedy and selfish as we were way back. You can see adults on any day acting like children; showing greed, jelousy and anger when someone has something better than they do. Will we be better and kinder 10,000 years from now? Or is spiritual or growth in kindness even part of the plan? Maybe what we see is all it's meant to be. Any opinions? Any further reading?
 
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What plan? To quote the immortal Frank Zappa, "You are what you is, and that's all it tis."Nature is not kind;
It treats all things impartially.
The Sage is not kind,
And treats all people impartially.
Nature is like a bellows,
Empty, yet never ceasing its supply.
The more it moves, the more it yields;
So the sage draws upon experience
And cannot be exhausted.
Lao Tzu

You either trust who and what you are or you don't. If you don't, sucks to be you.
 
Tregg Smith said:
Philosopher Olaf Stapledon wrote Starmaker and the First and Last Men; supposed to be the best of the best in science fiction or future history according to some authorities. The books cover a time span of a gazillion supereons in the evolution of life in the universe. Planets are born and die. Intelligent life develops as water and plant forms as well as mankind, then passes away and develops into other forms with different minds. I wonder if in our entire history we have grown spiritually at all or if we have not and are still just as warlike, egocentric, greedy and selfish as we were way back. You can see adults on any day acting like children; showing greed, jelousy and anger when someone has something better than they do. Will we be better and kinder 10,000 years from now? Or is spiritual or growth in kindness even part of the plan? Maybe what we see is all it's meant to be. Any opinions? Any further reading?

We have mutually agreed upon laws that, at least most of the time, protect us from being killed. This increases our lifespan and our quality of life and has raised our standard of living.

A larger and larger portion of the world's population can now be assured of shelter, food, a livelihood, protection under the law and freedom in the pursuit of happiness.

This was not a gift from elsewhere. We built it for ourselves because it's the world we wanted.
 
Tregg Smith said:
... is spiritual or growth in kindness even part of the plan?
Imo, no. We're an emergent artifact or byproduct of a fundamental wave dynamic(s). Nature is indifferent to our apprehension of things. Wrt nature there's no kindness and meanness, no good and evil. The 'spiritual' is an invention of humankind. It comforts us in our ignorance, and provides an unchallengable basis for social directives.
 
ThomasT said:
... is spiritual or growth in kindness even part of the plan?
Imo, no. We're an emergent artifact or byproduct of a fundamental wave dynamic(s). Nature is indifferent to our apprehension of things. Wrt nature there's no kindness and meanness, no good and evil. The 'spiritual' is an invention of humankind. It comforts us in our ignorance, and provides an unchallengable basis for social directives.

I think you've missed the point. Allow me to clarify:

... is spiritual or growth in kindness even part of our plan?
 
This does not meet the philosophy guidelines.
 

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