Hawking Radiation: Can Particles Appear with Relativistic Velocities?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of Hawking radiation, specifically questioning whether particles can appear with relativistic velocities when they spontaneously emerge near a black hole's event horizon. The scope includes theoretical interpretations and the implications of general relativity.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes Hawking radiation as arising from electron-positron pairs near the event horizon, with one particle escaping and the other being captured by the black hole.
  • The same participant questions whether particles must come into existence with relativistic velocities to escape the black hole's gravity.
  • Another participant challenges the validity of the initial description, stating it is a narrative to aid understanding of the mathematics rather than a factual account.
  • Further replies emphasize that discussing the details of a narrative deemed untrue is considered pointless, and that virtual particles do not possess speeds.
  • There is a suggestion that the original poster should engage more deeply with the mathematics of Hawking radiation rather than posing speculative questions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the validity of the initial claims about Hawking radiation. There is no consensus on the interpretation of the phenomenon or the nature of the particles involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the initial description may not accurately reflect the underlying physics, and there are unresolved issues regarding the nature of virtual particles and their properties.

Mike Holland
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The Hawking radiation comes from a pair of complementary particles, an electron and a positron for example, coming into existence spontaneously near the event horizon as a result of the intense gravitational field. One particle gets captured by the Black Hole while the other escapes, taking a bit of the BH mass with it. The mass of the two particles is "borrowed" from the BH.

My problem is that in order to escape. that particle must come into existence already moving radially outwards at close to the velocity of light, otherwise it cannot overcome the gravity. Do these particles really pop into existence with relativistic velocities?
 
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Well, your first paragraph is not true: it is a story to help make sense of the mathematics. So asking about the details is kind of pointless.
 
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Is it pointless to suggest that to escape from near the event horizon one has to have a velocity close to c?
 
I looked at your past posts. You've spent years tossing these random what-ifs at us. In that time, you could have learned GR.

And yes, what you write is pointless. Meaningless, actually. Virtual particles do not have speeds. Further, you missed an important point I wrote: your first paragraph is not true: it is a story to help make sense of the mathematics. Asking us to flesh out the details of something that is not true wastes everybody's time.
 
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Vanadium 50 said:
Asking us to flesh out the details of something that is not true wastes everybody's time.
Agreed; thread is closed. The OP's profile page says that he has a BS in Physics, so he should be able to do a bit more reading to figure this out. Maybe he'll do that reading and start a new thread with some current journal references if he still is having issues understanding the math behind Hawking radiation. :wink:
 
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