Heat wave? bring me the freeze ray

  • #1

Main Question or Discussion Point

i understand that heat acts as a wave,it has some variations depending on the frequency i believe.we all know we can build machines to create such waves.my understandings of physics tell me that waves can be nulled out by other inverse wave.my question:can heat be electromagnetically ruled out?
 

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  • #2
Drakkith
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i understand that heat acts as a wave,it has some variations depending on the frequency i believe.
This is incorrect. Heat is the transfer of energy from a hotter to colder object. The energy transfer can happen from direct contact or by EM radiation. EM waves have a frequency because they are waves, but heat is not a wave.

we all know we can build machines to create such waves.my understandings of physics tell me that waves can be nulled out by other inverse wave.my question:can heat be electromagnetically ruled out?
EM waves will interfere with each other, forming a diffraction pattern of peaks and nulls, but there is no way to turn this into a freeze ray.
 
  • #3
yeah but, heat waves can be polarized right? i know there is no such thing as a freeze ray, freeze waves do not exist. only heat waves do.and the rise of temperature that we feel is due to energy that flows in the infra red spectrum. my ideia is to fight fire with fire.if you can sum the heat wave for its inverse that the energy of that sum will be zero.and, if i multiply them up they will overlap and create NEGATIVE energy. can this be done? or my understadings of physics just plain suck?
 

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  • #4
Drakkith
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yeah but, heat waves can be polarized right? i know there is no such thing as a freeze ray, freeze waves do not exist. only heat waves do.
There is no such thing as a heat wave. Infrared radiation is made up of electromagnetic waves.

and the rise of temperature that we feel is due to energy that flows in the infra red spectrum. my ideia is to fight fire with fire.if you can sum the heat wave for its inverse that the energy of that sum will be zero.and, if i multiply them up they will overlap and create NEGATIVE energy. can this be done? or my understadings of physics just plain suck?
You cannot create negative energy. Even when two EM waves interfere destructively and create a null, you merely have zero energy being transported to that spot, not a negative amount. Also, remember that energy is transferred through all wavelengths of EM radiation, not just the infrared part.
 
  • #5
Averagesupernova
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Drakkith, I am not sure you are getting the point. I think the OP realizes that there is no such thing as a heat wave, he has just poorly chosen words. Everywhere you look infrared waves are striking matter. I think what the OP wants to know is if there is a way to cancel these waves. It goes without saying that if the effect of these waves were nullified then the matter would have a tendency to cool.
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Short answer is this: The infrared waves that strike the matter in our environment are way to random and out of control to begin with for a scheme like this to work.
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However, there is something that has been done for years that involves wave cancellation and reinforcement. The laser. Building a laser is a very precise operation.
 
  • #6
thank you supernova.i think you made my point a lot clearer.i also assumed that randomness would be an issue.but if you have a specific device that is a hot object lets say a cpu, the electrons passing through it will create infrared waves. if you analyze those waves for frequency, and distance, i mean if you can accurately determine its characteristics, can you use the same type of wave (modified of course) to nullify the infra red waves and also,heat.
 
  • #7
Also, remember that energy is transferred through all wavelengths of EM radiation, not just the infrared part.
does temperature rise with other types of wavelengths?
 
  • #8
Baluncore
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Since the thermal energy is transferred as broadband randomly phased radiation, you cannot generate an exact directional, amplitude and phase correct replica.

There is a trick, you can use the energy itself to generate a close to perfect replica by using a highly conductive surface to make a reflective mirror. The incident energy reaching the mirror generates an opposite wave that cancels almost all the forward travelling energy and so reflects the incident energy back at the angle of reflection.

So, a freezer ray will be a mirror, aimed to reflect energy you do not want, to where you want it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black-body_radiation
 
  • #9
Drakkith
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thank you supernova.i think you made my point a lot clearer.i also assumed that randomness would be an issue.but if you have a specific device that is a hot object lets say a cpu, the electrons passing through it will create infrared waves. if you analyze those waves for frequency, and distance, i mean if you can accurately determine its characteristics, can you use the same type of wave (modified of course) to nullify the infra red waves and also,heat.
Are you trying to cool the CPU?
 
  • #10
Borek
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does temperature rise with other types of wavelengths?
Temperature doesn't depend on the wavelength. Amount of energy carried by a photon does.

If your question is "is it possible to heat something with radiation other than IR", answer is yes (although there are plenty of fine details that can make it "no" in particular situations).
 
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  • #11
Are you trying to cool the CPU?
dude,im just thinking outside the box. the only way we have now to cool stuff down is by absortion of heat. i use cpu as an example because it's a body that emits heat, its thermal energy can be studied and too much heat goes against the cpu function.if you can use those EM to nullify the thermal waves emitted by it than you would find another way to cool equipments
 
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  • #12
Since the thermal energy is transferred as broadband randomly phased radiation, you cannot generate an exact directional, amplitude and phase correct replica.

There is a trick, you can use the energy itself to generate a close to perfect replica by using a highly conductive surface to make a reflective mirror. The incident energy reaching the mirror generates an opposite wave that cancels almost all the forward travelling energy and so reflects the incident energy back at the angle of reflection.

So, a freezer ray will be a mirror, aimed to reflect energy you do not want, to where you want it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black-body_radiation
you are telling me, we can use a conductive surface to work a mirror for heat?which we can redirect to wherever? =D
 
  • #13
Baluncore
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Yes. Have you never wondered why aluminium foil makes a good thermal insulator ?
 
  • #14
Drakkith
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dude,im just thinking outside the box. the only way we have now to cool stuff down is by absortion of heat. i use cpu as an example because it's a body that emits heat, its thermal energy can be studied and too much heat goes against the cpu function.if you can use those EM to nullify the thermal waves emitted by it than you would find another way to cool equipments
Okay, that's what I thought you meant, I just wasn't certain. Unfortunately this won't work. You can't nullify the thermal radiation emitted from it, nor would you want to, as thermal radiation is one way the CPU cools itself.

As I've been saying, heat is the transfer of energy. The CPU is hot, and therefor has a lot of thermal energy it needs to get rid of to cool off. A heat sink and fan usually do this by absorbing energy through direct contact with the CPU and then transferring it to the air. In addition, some of the energy is radiated away from the heat sink as thermal radiation, increasing the cooling rate. Note that thermal radiation is simply a specific way of generating EM radiation. Thermal radiation is not "heat waves".

The reason I keep saying that there is no such thing as heat waves is because I feel you have a misunderstanding about what heat and energy are. The thermal energy of the CPU cannot be nullified at all. It must be transferred somewhere else, either through conduction, convection, or radiation (of EM waves). Does that make sense?

you are telling me, we can use a conductive surface to work a mirror for heat?which we can redirect to wherever? =D
To be clear, it will reflect a large percentage of EM radiation falling on it. Survival blankets are shiny and reflective so that they reflect the infrared radiation from your body back onto yourself, slowing the transfer of thermal energy from your body to the outside, keeping you warm.
 
  • #15
okay.i get what you mean.thanks for being so patient.damn =C
 

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