How 4 atoms with the positions (0,0,0), (0,0,a), (0,a,0), and (a,0,0)?

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In summary, the conversation discusses the definition of a supercell as a cube with side length 2a containing four atoms located at specific positions. There is confusion about how this is possible and whether it is a matter of convention. The author of the book mentions the possibility of defining a supercell with a primitive cell, which would contain 8 atoms instead of 4. It is suggested that this may be an error in the book.
  • #1
masyousaf1
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We could have defined the supercell as
a cube with side length 2a containing four atoms located at (0,0,0), (0,0,a),
(0,a,0), and (a,0,0).

Kindly explain how can a cell with side length 2a is possible with the following postions (0,0,0), (0,0,a), (0,a,0), and (a,0,0) ?
 
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  • #2
What makes you think something is wrong with the cell?
 
  • #3
I am unable to understand the positions of the atoms if we change the cubic lattice from 'a' to '2a'. The cell with lattice constant 'a' is primitive while with '2a' the cell is just a unit cell. Kindly explain the positions in case of cell with lattice constant 2a ? The original text (We could have defined the supercell as
a cube with side length 2a containing four atoms located at (0,0,0), (0,0,a),
(0,a,0), and (a,0,0) ) is taken from a book.
 
  • #4
Would treating it as a cell with constant 'a' and positions (0,0,0), (0,0,a/2), (0,a/2,0) and (a/2,0,0) help?

I must admit I haven't dealt with these things for many years, but it looks like 'a' vs '2a' is just a matter of convention.
 
  • #5
Borek is right. The new primitive lattice parameter of the supercell could be, say, A=2a or a'=2a, and
within this cell the positions are (a'/2,0,0) or (A/2,0,0), etc.

When you deal with this all the time you get tired of defining new lattice parameters and just use 2a directly.

Defining a supercell is just a first step. In the following step you make the atoms at (a'/2,0,0) different from the ones at (0,0,0), e.g. by attaching opposite magnetic moments, displacing them a little bit, etc. You cannot do that in the original cell because (in this case) there is only one atom that cannot be different from itself.
 
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  • #6
But why there are only four positions mentioned for atoms ? I think in case of cubic lattice constant of side "a" there is one atom per unit cell (each atom at corner is shared by 8 adjcent unit cells). But in case of cubic lattice constant of side "2a" there might be four atoms per unit cell (I am not sure). My question is that why there are four atoms per unit cell in case of "2a" and how the author described their positions ? Kindly help
 
  • #7
I don't understand very well what you are asking or what the original statement of the book you are referring to are.
However, if you want to describe a primitive lattice with a cell of double side lenght, I would expect it to contain 8 atoms not four. Especially, there should be also atoms at (a,a,0), (a,0,a), (0,a,a) and (a,a,a), in addition to the ones you mentioned.
 
  • #8
Kindly have a look at the orignal text "For example, we could have defined the supercell as
a cube with side length 2a containing four atoms located at (0,0,0), (0,0,a),
(0,a,0), and (a,0,0). Repeating this larger volume in space defines a simple
cubic structure just as well as the smaller volume we looked at above. There
is clearly something special about our first choice, however, since it contains
the minimum number of atoms that can be used to fully define the structure (in
this case, 1). The supercell with this conceptually appealing property is called
the primitive cell." First choice refers to cube with length "a".
Reference is DENSITY FUNCTIONAL
THEORY A Practical Introduction by DAVID S. SHOLL (Chapter 2 page number 36)
Book can be downloaded from
http://en.bookfi.org/s/?q=DENSITY+FUNCTIONAL+THEORY+A+Practical+Introduction&t=0
Thank you for your attention
 
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  • #9
DrDu is right. If you double the side of the cube, you increase the volume by a factor of 2*2*2=8. So if in
the original primitive cubic cell there was 1 atom/a^3, then in the new cell there have to be 8 atoms/(8 a^3)
to get the same density.
 
  • #10
Dear sir So what we conclude the text in the book is incorrect ?
 
  • #11
Yes.
 

1. What is the significance of the four atoms with the positions (0,0,0), (0,0,a), (0,a,0), and (a,0,0)?

The four atoms with these positions form the vertices of a tetrahedron, a common structure in chemistry. This arrangement allows for strong bonding between the atoms, making it a stable configuration.

2. How do the positions of these four atoms affect their chemical properties?

The positions of the atoms determine the distance and angle between them, which in turn affects their bonding and reactivity with other atoms. The specific arrangement of these four atoms can result in unique chemical properties for the molecule or compound they form.

3. Can the positions of these four atoms be changed in a molecule or compound?

Yes, the positions of these atoms can be altered by chemical reactions or physical forces. For example, a molecule may undergo a conformational change where the atoms rotate or shift positions, leading to different chemical properties.

4. What is the significance of the "a" value in the positions of these four atoms?

The "a" value represents the distance between the atoms, which can affect their bonding and overall stability. A larger "a" value may result in weaker bonding, while a smaller value may lead to stronger bonding between the atoms.

5. How does the arrangement of these four atoms contribute to the overall structure of a molecule or compound?

The positions of these four atoms play a crucial role in determining the overall structure of a molecule or compound. The distance and angle between them can result in different shapes and structures, which in turn can impact the molecule's properties and functions.

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