How Do Constraints and Graphs Relate to Concentric Circles?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the mathematical properties and constraints related to concentric circles, specifically focusing on the inequalities that describe the area between two circles with given radii. Participants explore the meaning of constraints, the areas of the circles, and the implications of these constraints in a graphical context.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants define "constraints" as restrictions on equations or values, using examples from function notation.
  • Others clarify that concentric circles share the same center, with one circle lying inside the other, and discuss the areas of the circles based on their radii.
  • A participant proposes that the area between the circles can be expressed as $\pi(y^2 - x^2)$ and must satisfy the inequality $\pi(y^2 - x^2) \geq 10$.
  • There is uncertainty regarding the interpretation of part (b) of the original question, particularly what is meant by "the graph of the line in relation to the boundary of the inequality." Some suggest it may refer to a hyperbola derived from the inequality.
  • Concerns are raised about the clarity of the language used in the problem statement, with suggestions for more precise wording.
  • Participants debate the definition of concentric circles, with some asserting that not all circles within circles are concentric, emphasizing the requirement of a shared center.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the definition of concentric circles and the mathematical formulation of the area between them. However, there is disagreement and uncertainty regarding the interpretation of the problem's language and the specific graphical representation being requested.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express confusion over the phrasing of the problem, particularly regarding the term "line" and its relation to the hyperbola, indicating potential ambiguity in the mathematical language used.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in mathematical inequalities, geometric properties of circles, and the interpretation of mathematical language in problem statements may find this discussion beneficial.

mathland
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Two concentric circles have radii x and y, where y > x. The area between the circles is at least 10 square units.

(a) Write a system of inequalities that describes the constraints on the circles.

What does the word CONSTRAINTS mean here?

(b) Identify the graph of the line in relation to the boundary of the inequality. Explain its meaning in
the context of the problem.

What exactly is part (b) asking for?
 
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A constraint is a restriction on the equation or the values given. For example, we can constrain the graph of [math]y = x^2[/math], which normally acts on all real numbers x, to just be for all x > 0.

If you are up on function notation, [math]y = x^2[/math] is the set [math]\{ y(x) = x^2 | x \in \mathbb{R} \}[/math]. Everything after the | is some kind of constraint.

-Dan
 
topsquark said:
A constraint is a restriction on the equation or the values given. For example, we can constrain the graph of [math]y = x^2[/math], which normally acts on all real numbers x, to just be for all x > 0.

If you are up on function notation, [math]y = x^2[/math] is the set [math]\{ y(x) = x^2 | x \in \mathbb{R} \}[/math]. Everything after the | is some kind of constraint.

-Dan

Let me work on this a bit more.
 
Two concentric circles have radii x and y with y> x. Do you know what "concentric" means? What is the area of the circle with radius x? What is the area of the circle with radius y? What is the area of the region between the circles?
 
Country Boy said:
Two concentric circles have radii x and y with y> x. Do you know what "concentric" means? What is the area of the circle with radius x? What is the area of the circle with radius y? What is the area of the region between the circles?

a) y > x;

x > 0;

pi(y^2 - x^2) >= 10.

(b) No idea what is being requested.
 
You quoted my questions but didn't actually answer them.
I presume you mean that you do know that "concentric circles" are circles that have the same center and so one, the one with the smaller radius, is inside the other.

A circle with radius "x" has area $\pi x^2$, a circle with radius "y" has area $\pi y^2$ and, since y> x, the area between them is $\pi y^2- \pi x^2= \pi(y^2- x^2)$. We are told that the area between the two circles is "at least 10 square units" so the "constraint" is, as you say, $\pi(y^2-x^2)\ge 10$.

(b) Identify the graph of the line in relation to the boundary of the inequality. Explain its meaning in
the context of the problem.
I am not sure what "line" this is asking about. The best I can do is say that the graph of $\pi(x^2- y^2)= 10$, or $x^2- y^2= \frac{10}{\pi}$ is a hyperbola with axes along the coordinate axes and vertices at $\left(\pm\sqrt{\frac{10}{\pi}}, 0\right)$. The inequality $\pi(x^2- y^2)\ge 10$ is satisfied to the right and left of that hyperbola so the hyperbola itself is the boundary.
("Identify the graph of the line in relation to the boundary of the inequality" sees to me awkward English grammar. I would have said "identify the graph forming the boundary of the inequality". Also the use of the word "line" makes me wonder if they do not mean the asymptotes of the hyperbola, the lines y= x and y= -x, but that seems unlikely. )
 
Country Boy said:
You quoted my questions but didn't actually answer them.
I presume you mean that you do know that "concentric circles" are circles that have the same center and so one, the one with the smaller radius, is inside the other.

A circle with radius "x" has area $\pi x^2$, a circle with radius "y" has area $\pi y^2$ and, since y> x, the area between them is $\pi y^2- \pi x^2= \pi(y^2- x^2)$. We are told that the area between the two circles is "at least 10 square units" so the "constraint" is, as you say, $\pi(y^2-x^2)\ge 10$.I am not sure what "line" this is asking about. The best I can do is say that the graph of $\pi(x^2- y^2)= 10$, or $x^2- y^2= \frac{10}{\pi}$ is a hyperbola with axes along the coordinate axes and vertices at $\left(\pm\sqrt{\frac{10}{\pi}}, 0\right)$. The inequality $\pi(x^2- y^2)\ge 10$ is satisfied to the right and left of that hyperbola so the hyperbola itself is the boundary.
("Identify the graph of the line in relation to the boundary of the inequality" sees to me awkward English grammar. I would have said "identify the graph forming the boundary of the inequality". Also the use of the word "line" makes me wonder if they do not mean the asymptotes of the hyperbola, the lines y= x and y= -x, but that seems unlikely. )

Concentric circles are circles within circles.
 
Country Boy said:
You quoted my questions but didn't actually answer them.
I presume you mean that you do know that "concentric circles" are circles that have the same center and so one, the one with the smaller radius, is inside the other.

A circle with radius "x" has area $\pi x^2$, a circle with radius "y" has area $\pi y^2$ and, since y> x, the area between them is $\pi y^2- \pi x^2= \pi(y^2- x^2)$. We are told that the area between the two circles is "at least 10 square units" so the "constraint" is, as you say, $\pi(y^2-x^2)\ge 10$.I am not sure what "line" this is asking about. The best I can do is say that the graph of $\pi(x^2- y^2)= 10$, or $x^2- y^2= \frac{10}{\pi}$ is a hyperbola with axes along the coordinate axes and vertices at $\left(\pm\sqrt{\frac{10}{\pi}}, 0\right)$. The inequality $\pi(x^2- y^2)\ge 10$ is satisfied to the right and left of that hyperbola so the hyperbola itself is the boundary.
("Identify the graph of the line in relation to the boundary of the inequality" sees to me awkward English grammar. I would have said "identify the graph forming the boundary of the inequality". Also the use of the word "line" makes me wonder if they do not mean the asymptotes of the hyperbola, the lines y= x and y= -x, but that seems unlikely. )

You said:

"Identify the graph of the line in relation to the boundary of the inequality" sees to me awkward English grammar. I would have said "identify the graph forming the boundary of the inequality". Also the use of the word "line" makes me wonder if they do not mean the asymptotes of the hyperbola, the lines y= x and y= -x, but that seems unlikely."

The English found in most math and physics textbooks is awkward in so many ways. In fact, this is the main reason why I struggle with applications.
 
mathland said:
Concentric circles are circles within circles.
No, not all "circles within circles" are concentric. Concentric circle are circles that have the same center. It follows that one is inside the other. The circle $(x- 1)^2+ y^2= 1$ is "within" $x^2+ y^2= 9$ but they are not "concentric".
 

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