How Do High-Speed Objects Traverse High-Temperature Gaseous Nebulas?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of high-speed objects traversing high-temperature gaseous nebulas, specifically addressing the implications of temperature and density of interstellar gases on solid objects such as spaceships or asteroids. Participants explore theoretical aspects, potential challenges, and the nature of the gases involved.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how solid objects can survive high temperatures in gaseous nebulas, noting that reported temperatures can reach thousands of degrees Kelvin.
  • Another participant suggests that while the temperatures are high, the low density of the gases means that the heat transfer to a solid object would be minimal, potentially preventing melting.
  • A later reply emphasizes that the temperature measurements refer to the same concept of temperature understood on Earth, but highlights that the interstellar medium can reach even higher temperatures, up to 10^6 K in some regions.
  • It is noted that high temperatures can dissociate atoms into ions and free electrons, forming a plasma, but this does not render them unrecognizable by telescopes, as emission lines can still be detected.
  • One participant expresses skepticism about the existence of pockets of high density in the interstellar medium, suggesting that gas laws would govern the behavior of gases in space and questioning the mechanisms that could lead to such pockets.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of high temperatures and low densities, with some agreeing on the low heat transfer to solid objects while others question the existence of high-density pockets. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the mechanisms of gas behavior in the context of high-speed objects.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include assumptions about the behavior of gases under varying conditions, the dependence on definitions of temperature, and the unresolved nature of the mechanisms that could create high-density regions in the interstellar medium.

pedro the swift
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Greetings,
I read with interest some of the reports and studies of the "measurement" of the temperature of interstellar gases(H2, O2 etc) surrounding some gaseous nebulas(nebulae). Some reported temps. are in the thousands of degs. K. I was wondering how a solid object traveling at high speed would be able to traverse these regions without suffering "meltdown". as these temperatures are far higher than any metal or alloy we know can withstand.
I realize that these gases are VERY dispersed generally but could there be pockets of high enough density(relative to space) that could disrupt a speeding body(spaceship, asteroid etc). Is the reported "temperature" what we understand as temperature on earth? Would not the atoms themselves be disassociated by such high temperatures and be unrecognisable by our telescopes(radio, etc)?
Thanks for your interest.!
 
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Combined with the low density is the low energy content. So you have to consider how much time it will take for the gas to heat up the object and by how much it will cool down when heating the object.

I am not a specialist intros field, but I would assume that molecular gases are much colder, and that it is ionized gases that make up the thousand-K clouds.
 
pedro the swift said:
Greetings,
I read with interest some of the reports and studies of the "measurement" of the temperature of interstellar gases(H2, O2 etc) surrounding some gaseous nebulas(nebulae). Some reported temps. are in the thousands of degs. K. I was wondering how a solid object traveling at high speed would be able to traverse these regions without suffering "meltdown". as these temperatures are far higher than any metal or alloy we know can withstand.
I realize that these gases are VERY dispersed generally but could there be pockets of high enough density(relative to space) that could disrupt a speeding body(spaceship, asteroid etc). Is the reported "temperature" what we understand as temperature on earth? Would not the atoms themselves be disassociated by such high temperatures and be unrecognisable by our telescopes(radio, etc)?
Thanks for your interest.!

A couple of points:
(1) The temperature of the interstellar medium can be even higher than thousands of deg K. In some regions, the temperature can be 10^6 K or even higher.
(2) These temperatures are the same thing as we mean by temperature here on Earth, but as DrClaude said, the density is so low that the heat transferred to a solid object would be very small, so would not result in melting.
(3) The atoms themselves are in fact dissociated by the high temperatures. This is what we mean by a plasma, where the atoms have been dissociated into ions and free electrons. However, this does not mean that they are "unrecognisable by our telescopes". Ionized atoms still generate atomic transitions with well defined energies, so we can see emission lines from these ionized atoms. The attached spectrum shows emission lines from a nebula. O-III, for example means it is an emission line from an Oxygen atom from which two electrons have been stripped. Similarly, Ar-iV is an emission line from an Argon atom from which three electrons have been stripped.

bv1r.jpg
 

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pedro the swift said:
pockets of high enough density
I can't think of a mechanism to achieve this when the normal gas Laws will be govening the behaviour of masses of gas in the absence of 'walls'. I could imagine that a mass of gas at high velocity - say from an explosion - would 'contain' more significant momentum.
 

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