How do I pass a magnetic field to any coordinate system?

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on how to express a magnetic field vector in different coordinate systems, particularly in the context of electromagnetic theory and the relationships defined by Maxwell's equations. Participants explore various mathematical formulations and approaches related to the transformation of magnetic fields and their expressions in curvilinear coordinates.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents the transformation of an electric field vector to any coordinate system using the gradient of the potential, questioning how a magnetic field vector would be similarly expressed.
  • Another participant introduces the electromagnetic field tensor as a way to express electric and magnetic fields in any coordinate system, providing a specific formulation involving the curl in curvilinear coordinates.
  • A participant attempts to relate the curl of the electric field to the magnetic field using Maxwell's equations, proposing a specific mathematical manipulation but expresses uncertainty about its correctness.
  • Another participant challenges the previous mathematical manipulation, indicating that it does not make sense.
  • One participant references the Biot-Savart law to relate the magnetic field to the electric field and velocity, questioning how to express this relationship in any coordinate system and whether the components can be transformed separately before taking the cross product.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the correct approach to transforming magnetic field vectors and the validity of certain mathematical manipulations. There is no consensus on the correct method or formulation, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Some mathematical steps and assumptions in the transformations are not fully resolved, and the dependence on specific coordinate systems is implied but not explicitly stated. The discussion involves complex relationships that may require further clarification or exploration.

raistlin
Messages
3
Reaction score
0
Hello,
For example, an electric field vector, such as the gradient of the potential, passes in the following way to any coordinate system:$$E = -\triangledown{}V = - \frac{{\partial V}}{{\partial x^i}}g^{ij}e_j$$
But what about a vector of a magnetic field? How would it be expressed in any coordinate system?

Thanks!
 
Physics news on Phys.org
In relativity, the electric and magnetic fields are part of the electromagnetic field tensor, which is expressed as
$$
F_{\mu\nu} = \partial_\mu A_\nu - \partial_\nu A_\mu,
$$
which holds in any coordinate system.

If you are just interested in the expression of the curl in curvilinear coordinates in three dimensions, you have
$$
\nabla \times \vec A = \vec e_i \eta^{ijk} \partial_j A_k,
$$
where ##\vec e_i## are the tangent vector basis vectors, ##\eta^{ijk} = (1/\sqrt{g}) \epsilon^{ijk}##, and ##A_k## are the covariant components of ##\vec A##. Here ##g## is the metric determinant.
 
Thanks for the answer, but it's not exactly what I was finding for ..

I know from Maxwell's third equation that:$$\triangledown{} \times{} \vec{E}= -\frac{{\partial B}}{{\partial t}}$$Therefore$$(\triangledown{} \times{} \vec{E}) {\partial t}= -{\partial \vec{B}} \Longrightarrow{} \frac{{\partial t}}{{\partial r}}\times{}\frac{{\partial V}}{{\partial r}}={\partial \vec{B}}\Longrightarrow{}\vec{B}=\triangledown{}t\times{}\triangledown{}V$$ Is it correct?
And from here I do not know how to continue ..
 
raistlin said:
Thanks for the answer, but it's not exactly what I was finding for ..

I know from Maxwell's third equation that:$$\triangledown{} \times{} \vec{E}= -\frac{{\partial B}}{{\partial t}}$$Therefore$$(\triangledown{} \times{} \vec{E}) {\partial t}= -{\partial \vec{B}} \Longrightarrow{} \frac{{\partial t}}{{\partial r}}\times{}\frac{{\partial V}}{{\partial r}}={\partial \vec{B}}\Longrightarrow{}\vec{B}=\triangledown{}t\times{}\triangledown{}V$$ Is it correct?
And from here I do not know how to continue ..
No. Sorry, but this makes no sense.
 
Yes, you're right..

But if I use the Biot-Savart law I have:$$B = \displaystyle\frac{1}{c^2}v\times{}E\Longrightarrow{}B c^2= v\times{}E\Longrightarrow{}-B c^2=\frac{dr}{dt}\times{}\triangledown{}V$$How would this be to any coordinate system? Could I pass the velocity and the gradient separately and then make a cross product?
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
4K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
5K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K