Understanding the Automatic Formation of Lie Subgroups in a Lie Group

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the automatic formation of Lie subgroups within a Lie group, particularly focusing on the conditions under which a subgroup defined by the vanishing of continuous real-valued functions is considered a Lie subgroup. Participants explore the implications of not needing to check maximal rank conditions for the defining functions.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions why a subgroup defined by the vanishing of continuous functions is automatically a Lie subgroup and why maximal rank conditions do not need to be checked.
  • Another participant argues that the initial statement is false, citing a counterexample involving the group of real numbers, suggesting that additional conditions are necessary for the statement to hold.
  • A different participant asserts that the statement is true, referencing the theorem that a closed subgroup of a Lie group is itself a Lie group.
  • One participant acknowledges a misunderstanding regarding the assumption that the subgroup is already defined as a subgroup.
  • Another participant expresses confidence in the correctness of the statement but seeks clarification on how to verify it using the definition of a Lie group, particularly regarding the maximal rank conditions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit disagreement regarding the validity of the initial statement about Lie subgroups. While some assert its truth under certain conditions, others provide counterexamples that challenge its general applicability. The discussion remains unresolved with competing views on the necessity of checking maximal rank conditions.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the definitions of Lie groups and the specific conditions under which the subgroup is considered. The discussion highlights the dependence on the properties of the functions defining the subgroup.

hunhengy
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Recently, I read the follow paragraph:

Let $G$ be a Lie group. If $H$ is a subgroup defined by the vanishing of a number of (continuous) real-valued functions
$$H=\{g\in G| F_i(g)=0, i=1,2,\cdots,n\},$$
then $H$ is automatically a Lie subgroup of $G$. We do not need to check the maximal rank conditions of the $F_i$.

Why is $H$ autonmatically a Lie subgroup of $G$? Why should not need to check the maximal rank conditions of the $F_i$?
 
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This statement is not true as it is easy to construct a couter example, for instance for G=R.The statement would be true if you would require f(ab)=f(a)+f(b), f(e)=0.
 
The statement is true (since we're assuming H is a subgroup).

Are you familiar with the theorem that a (topologically) closed subgroup of a Lie group is a Lie group?
 
You are right. I missed the part that H was assumed to be a subgroup.
 
I know this statement is right. The only thing is that I can not check it by the definition of Lie Group? Why should not need to check the maximal rank conditions of the $F_i$?
 

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