How, in general, do you expand an expression in powers of some variable?

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the general method of expanding expressions in powers of a variable, particularly in the context of mechanics and Taylor expansions. Participants explore the application of Taylor's theorem to functions of multiple variables and the implications of such expansions in physics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks clarification on how to expand expressions in powers of an infinitesimal vector, specifically questioning the role of partial derivatives in the expansion.
  • Another participant suggests a generalization of expansion by considering the directional derivative and provides a formula for expanding functions of multiple variables.
  • Some participants assert that expanding in powers is essentially applying Taylor's series, noting that for functions of several variables, derivatives become partial derivatives.
  • There is a discussion on the notation used for derivatives, with some participants questioning the meaning of expressions like \(\frac{\partial L}{\partial \vec{v}^2}\) when \(L\) is a function of one variable.
  • Several participants express confusion about the expansion process and the assumptions made, particularly regarding the treatment of higher-order terms as negligible.
  • One participant emphasizes the importance of ignoring higher-order terms in the context of small perturbations, while another questions the necessity of expanding in multiple variables.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit a mix of agreement and disagreement regarding the method of expansion and the interpretation of derivatives. While some agree on the application of Taylor's theorem, others challenge the notation and the necessity of expanding in several variables, indicating that the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the assumptions underlying the expansions, particularly regarding the treatment of infinitesimals and the definitions of derivatives in the context of multiple variables. There are also unresolved questions about the notation used for derivatives.

AxiomOfChoice
Messages
531
Reaction score
1
How, in general, do you "expand" an expression in powers of some variable?

I'm studying mechanics right now out of the Landau-Lifschitz book, and he often talks about expanding expressions. But I honestly don't know how to do this, in general. I know about forming Taylor expansions of functions of one variable, but when things get to more than one variable, I start to get confused. Let me give you an example: Apparently, if we expand a function

<br /> L(\vec{v}^2 + 2\vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2)<br />

"in powers of \vec{\epsilon}," to first order, where \vec{\epsilon} is some infinitesimal vector, we get

<br /> L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{\partial L}{\partial \vec{v}^2} 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon}.<br />

Could someone please explain why that is? You know, how to get that? And what's so special about expanding "in powers of \vec{\epsilon}?" As best I can tell, we are letting \vec{\epsilon} = 0 when we do the expansion. So are we expanding L about \vec{\epsilon} = 0? If so, why are we taking a partial of L with respect to \vec{v}^2?

I have tried to use the information provided at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taylor_Series to figure this out - particularly what's at the bottom of the page - but without much success.
 
Physics news on Phys.org


a simple generalization easily seen by expanding by each variable in turn
let x,h be vectors
D the vector derivative so h.D is the directional derivative times h's magnitude
f(x+h)=exp(h.D)f(x)=f(x)+[h.D]f(x)+[(h.D)^2]f(x)/2!+[(h.D)^3]f+...+[(h.D)^k]f(x)/k!+...
 


If you are asking about how to get that and why it involves a derivative, "expanding in powers" is just the Taylor's series: The Taylor's series for function f(x), about x= a is
f(a)+ \frac{df}{dx}(x-a)+ \frac{1}{2}\frac{d^2f}{dx^2}(x- a)^2+ \cdot\cdot\cdot
= \sum_{n=0}^\infty \frac{1}{n!}\frac{d^n f}{dx^n} (x- a)^n
Of course, if f is a function of several variables, that derivative just becomes the partial derivative with respect to the relevant variable.
 


I'am a little confused about this expansion too.

<br /> L(\vec{v&#039;}^2) = L(\vec{v}^2 + 2\vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2)<br />

At point a = \vec{v}&#039;^2 = \vec{v}^2 + 2\vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2 this expands to

<br /> \begin{align*}<br /> L(\vec{v&#039;}^2) &amp;= L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{\partial L}{\partial \vec{v&#039;}^2} ( \vec{v}^2 + 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2 - \vec{v}^2) + \cdots \\<br /> <br /> &amp;= L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{\partial L}{\partial \vec{v&#039;}^2} ( 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2) + \cdots\\<br /> <br /> &amp;= L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{\partial L}{\partial \vec{v&#039;}^2} 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \frac{\partial L}{\partial \vec{v&#039;}^2} \vec{\epsilon}^2 + \cdots<br /> \end{align*}<br />
We leave just two terms and drop everything else, because then \vec{\epsilon} approaches 0 everything else is a lot smaller.

So we get
<br /> L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{\partial L}{\partial \vec{v&#039;}^2} 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon}<br />
The remaining question is how to get?
<br /> \partial \vec{v&#039;}^2 = \partial \vec{v}^2<br />
 


In principle this is just Taylor's theorem in several variables. In physics this is used extensively, but I also don't always directly see how it is done. So I decided to write it out in a more formal way.

We have a function of one variable L:\mathbb{R}\to\mathbb{R}: x\mapsto L(x), and the inner product, a function of n variables, g:\mathbb{R}^n\to\mathbb{R}:\vec{x}\mapsto \vec{x}\cdot\vec{x}=\vec{x}^2.

We are interested in the composition L\circ g:\mathbb{R}^n\to\mathbb{R}, evaluated at \vec{v}+\vec{\epsilon}, since this is indeed (L\circ g)(\vec{v}+\vec{\epsilon})=L((\vec{v}+\vec{\epsilon})^2)=L(\vec{v}^2+2\vec{v}\cdot\vec{\epsilon}+\vec{\epsilon}^2). We're going to appoximate this assuming epsilon is small.

Taylor's theorem from Wikipedia says T(\vec{x}) = f(\vec{a}) + (\vec{x} - \vec{a})^T\mathrm{D} f(\vec{a}) + \frac{1}{2!} (\vec{x} - \vec{a})^T \,\{\mathrm{D}^2 f(\vec{a})\}\,(\vec{x} - \vec{a}) + \cdots, for the Taylor expansion of f around the point a.

Substituting a=v, h=\epsilon, x=a+h=v+\epsilon, we get T(\vec{v}+\vec{\epsilon}) = f(\vec{v}) + (\vec{\epsilon})^T\mathrm{D} f(\vec{v}) + \frac{1}{2!} (\vec{\epsilon})^T \,\{\mathrm{D}^2 f(\vec{v})\}\vec{\epsilon} + \cdots.

Now, the assumption that epsilon is small leads to the ignoring of powers of epsilon greater than one, i.e. all terms from \frac{1}{2!} (\vec{\epsilon})^T \,\{\mathrm{D}^2 f(\vec{v})\}\vec{\epsilon} + \cdots on are ignored because of the occurrence of at least two epsilon factors (here under the disguise of (\vec{\epsilon})^T and \vec{\epsilon}).

Now we compute this for f=L\circ g:
T(\vec{v}+\vec{\epsilon}) = (L\circ g)(\vec{v}) + (\vec{\epsilon})^T\mathrm{D} (L\circ g)(\vec{v}), using the chain rule in several dimensions: D(L\circ g)(x)=DL(g(x))\circ Dg(x). Since L is just a function of one variable, this is equal to the product of the number L&#039;(g(x)), i.e. the derivative of L evaluated at the point g(x), with the vector Dg(x).

Now, since g(\vec{x})=x_1^2+x_2^2+...+x_n^2, we have

Dg(\vec{x})=\left(\frac{\partial g}{\partial x_1},\frac{\partial g}{\partial x_2},...,\frac{\partial g}{\partial x_n}\right)=(2x_1,2x_1,...,2x_n).

So
T(\vec{v}+\vec{\epsilon}) = (L\circ g)(\vec{v}) + (\vec{\epsilon})^T\mathrm{D} (L\circ g)(\vec{v})

=L(\vec{v}^2)+(\vec{\epsilon})^TL&#039;(\vec{v}^2)Dg(\vec{v})
=L(\vec{v}^2)+L&#039;(\vec{v}^2)(\epsilon_1,\epsilon_2,...,\epsilon_n)\cdot (2v_1,2v_1,...,2v_n)
={L(\vec{v}^2)+L&#039;(\vec{v}^2)2\vec{\epsilon}\cdot\vec{v}.

The only question is, what do L&L mean by \frac{\partial L}{\partial \vec{v}^2}? L is just a function of one variable, so it doesn't really make sense to talk about partial derivatives. My notation L&#039;(\vec{v}^2) is unambiguous: THE derivative of L, evualated at \vec{v}^2.
 


Landau said:
In principle this is just Taylor's theorem in several variables. In physics this is used extensively, but I also don't always directly see how it is done. So I decided to write it out in a more formal way.

I think your way is too difficult in this case. Why do you expand in several variables?

I found the answer and will correct my previous post soon.
 


<br /> L(x) = L(\vec{v&#039;}^2) = L(\vec{v}^2 + 2\vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2)<br />

At point a = \vec{v}^2 this expands to

<br /> \begin{align*}<br /> L(x) &amp;= L(a) + \frac{d L(a)}{d x} ( x - a) + \cdots \\<br /> <br /> &amp;= L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{d L(\vec{v}^2)}{d x} ( \vec{v}^2 + 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2 - \vec{v}^2) + \cdots \\<br /> <br /> &amp;= L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{d L(\vec{v}^2)}{d x} ( 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2) + \cdots\\<br /> <br /> &amp;= L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{d L(\vec{v}^2)}{d x} 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \frac{d L(\vec{v}^2)}{d x} \vec{\epsilon}^2 + \cdots<br /> \end{align*}<br />
We leave just two terms and drop everything else, because then \vec{\epsilon} approaches 0 everything else is a lot smaller.

d x = d(\vec{v}^2 + 2\vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2) = 2 d(\vec{v}) + 2 \vec{\epsilon} d(\vec{v}) = (1+\vec{\epsilon}) 2 d(\vec{v}) = (1+\vec{\epsilon}) d(\vec{v}^2)

Because \vec{\epsilon} approaches 0 and is a lot smaller then 1 we drop it. So

d x = d(\vec{v}^2)

And finally
<br /> L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{d L(\vec{v}^2)}{d \vec{v}^2} 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon}<br />
 


Marius said:
I think your way is too difficult in this case.
I don't think it is difficult, I just thoroughly explained what I was doing and using.
Why do you expand in several variables?
How can you not expand in several variables, given that we are considering n-dimensional vectors \vec{v} (of course, in classical mechanics, n=3)?
Marius said:
<br /> L(x) = L(\vec{v&#039;}^2) =...
<br /> = L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{d L(\vec{v}^2)}{d x} ( \vec{v}^2 + 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2 - \vec{v}^2) + \cdots
I'm a bit confused about your notation. What does the expression \frac{d L(\vec{v}^2)}{d x} mean? Just L&#039;(\vec{v}^2), the derivative of L evaluated at the point \vec{v}^2? My problem with this notation is the use of d/dx; it suggests you are differentiating 'with respect to x' (whatever that means for a function of one variable), but you earlier defined x as v'^2.
Same here:
d x = d(\vec{v}^2 + 2\vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon} + \vec{\epsilon}^2) = 2 d(\vec{v}) + 2 \vec{\epsilon} d(\vec{v}) = (1+\vec{\epsilon}) 2 d(\vec{v}) = (1+\vec{\epsilon}) d(\vec{v}^2)

Because \vec{\epsilon} approaches 0 and is a lot smaller then 1 we drop it. So

d x = d(\vec{v}^2)

And finally
<br /> L(\vec{v}^2) + \frac{d L(\vec{v}^2)}{d \vec{v}^2} 2 \vec{v} \cdot \vec{\epsilon}<br />
what does the expression \frac{d L(\vec{v}^2)}{d \vec{v}^2} mean?

Maybe my problem is that following mathematics courses has made me unconfortable with this kind of 'physics approach', of just calculating things like d(\vec{v}^2), and substituting the result in the 'denominator of the derivative'.
 


Landau said:
How can you not expand in several variables, given that we are considering n-dimensional vectors \vec{v} (of course, in classical mechanics, n=3)?
But \vec{v&#039;}^2 is scalar.

Landau said:
I'm a bit confused about your notation.

Oh, of course, you are right, this notation is strange. Now I'm confused too :)
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
3K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
1K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
1K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 0 ·
Replies
0
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
997
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
995
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K