How is the magnitude of L calculated here?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the calculation of angular momentum, specifically how the magnitude of angular momentum (L) is derived in the context of the Earth's motion when the Sun disappears. The subject area includes concepts from classical mechanics, particularly angular momentum and vector mathematics.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the relationship between angular momentum and the cross product of vectors, questioning the use of sine in the formula for magnitude. There is also discussion about whether angular momentum can be derived without vectors.

Discussion Status

The conversation is ongoing, with participants seeking clarification on the mathematical formulation of angular momentum and its dependence on vector properties. Some guidance is offered regarding the nature of the cross product, but no consensus has been reached on the necessity of vector representation in this context.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express confusion about the use of vectors and the implications of the angular momentum formula, indicating a potential gap in understanding the foundational concepts of angular momentum in a non-vector context.

Benjamin_harsh
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Homework Statement
How magnitude of L is calculated here?
Relevant Equations
How magnitude of L is calculated here?
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The green dot shows the position of the Earth at the instant the Sun disappears. The distance from the Sun, ##d##, is the Earth's orbital distance and the velocity ##v## is the Earth's orbital velocity.

When the Sun disappears the Earth heads off in a straight line at constant velocity as shown by the horizontal dashed line, so after some time ##t## it has moved a distance ##x = vt## as I've marked on the diagram. The question is now how the angular momentum can be conserved.

The answer is that angular momentum is given by the vector equation:

## \mathbf L = \mathbf r \times m\mathbf v ##

where ##\mathbf r## is the position vector, ##\mathbf v## is the velocity vector and ##\times## is the cross product. We are going to end up with the vector ##\mathbf L## pointing out of the page and the magnitude of ##L## is given by:

## |\mathbf L| = m\,|\mathbf r|\,|\mathbf v|\,\sin\theta \tag{1} ##

but looking at our diagram we see that:

## \sin\theta = \large\frac{d}{|\mathbf r|} ##

and if we substitute this into our equation (1) for the angular momentum we get:

## |\mathbf L| = m\,|\mathbf r|\,|\mathbf v|\,\large\frac{d}{|\mathbf r|}\normalsize = m\,|\mathbf v|\,d \tag{2} ##

And this equation tells us that the angular momentum is constant i.e. it depends only on the constant velocity ##\mathbf v## and the original orbital distance ##d##.

I didn't understand how ##|\mathbf L| = m\,|\mathbf r|\,|\mathbf v|\,\sin\theta## is written? Why ##sin## instead of ##cos## or ##tan##?

I only know one formula for angular momentum; ##L = mvr##.
 
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Benjamin_harsh said:
I didn't understand how |L|=m|r||v|sinθ is written?
Do you mean, how they get to that equation?
It follows from the nature of the cross product, ##|\vec x\times\vec y|=|x| |y||\sin(\theta)|##, where ##\theta## is the angle between the vectors.
 
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Benjamin_harsh said:
Problem Statement: How magnitude of L is calculated here?
Relevant Equations: How magnitude of L is calculated here?

I only know one formula for angular momentum; L=mvrL=mvrL = mvr.
This is only true in special cases.
The general form is L=m r x v where x is the vector cross product, which has
haruspex said:
$$|\vec x\times\vec y|=|x| |y||\sin(\theta)|$$
 
Why we have to use vectors here?

Can't we derive Earth's angular momentum without vectors?
 
Benjamin_harsh said:
Why we have to use vectors here?

Can't we derive Earth's angular momentum without vectors?
You will have to learn about vectors when you get to high school anyways.

You can do it with NOT THINKING about vectors but you are still imolicitly using L= mr x v
 

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