How much money is sufficient for you?

[Zantra]

please tell me:

1) how much to own a 1500 sq feet house or apartment in US
2) how much to buy a car as good as Honda Accord
3) how much to spend on petrol if you travel 300 km per week.
4) how much on food and drinks
5) water and electricity bill
6) telephone bill

Total = ______________ ?

I see your point.. to live the kind of lifestyle you're talking about still varies- for instance to rent a house like that here in LA will run you about 2500/month. But if you just want an average, I can guesstimate that if you live in the middle of a range you would need about 2-3000/month to live off of. The average household US income is $42,000. That's roughly 2200/month after taxes. That should be easy to make with a competitive bachleors degree.

 

[cragwolf]

I live contentedly on between $15k and $20k a year. I don't own a car (I walk to work, about 80 mins each way), I don't eat out in restaurants, I don't buy many clothes (certainly not expensive ones), I don't buy DVDs and CDs or any expensive consumer gadgets, I don't use Windows (I'm a Linux user), I don't drink alcohol or smoke, I don't go to the cinema, I don't have a girlfriend, I don't travel or go away on holidays, I don't gamble ... so I tend to avoid the most common drains on people's wallets. My three main expenses are rent ($150/week), food ($100/week) and physics/maths/astronomy books. Oh, and once every 4 or 5 years I buy a computer.

 

[russ_watters]

Regarding food, I eat out at a sit-down restaurant of Applebees, Friday's, Olive Garden, or comparable quality (low-end, but decent sit down) once or twice a week. I always get the most expensive meal of any of my friends. A steak-and-shrimp combo for ~$18 is my usual at Friday's. But that's not a normal thing for me.

On a normal day, I eat a Wendy's, or Subway, or grocery store chicken ceasar salad lunch. I never pay more than $10, often less than $5. For dinner, I'm a little lazy and I never cook for real. Canned beef stew is a usual ($.50 - $1) and if I'm feeling like gourmet, a half a bag of a pre-cooked meal-in-a-bag chicken stir fry or something of the like (~$2.50).

But like I said before: your costs will inevitably expand to fill your money available. If your daughter didn't have the money for a $20 meal every night, she'd eat at Subway. It may feel like a step down for her, and you're right, Evo - people get used to what hey are used to - but I think its better to have it a little tough as a teen because you do get used to it and it makes it easier to live within your means when you are older. Even as a sligtly below average young engineer (I got a late start), my lifestyle feels downright opulent compared to my teenage years.

 

[Zantra]

To Russ' statement I would add that I have BEEN to Olive Garden RECENTLY. It cost me 22 bucks for TWO people WITH tip (and I got a glass of wine I might add). AND it was in L.A. And aside from NY or San Fran, there is no other location in the states that is more expensive to eat out. For 20 bucks I could eat at Cheesecake factory, PF changs, macaroni grill, etc and still have money left over (allbeit not a lot), or virtually any food place in LA that's not "hot" or catering to famous clientelle. I'm having trouble even coming up with a restaurant where I could spend more than $20 on a meal. (well known nationally I mean). Even if we set aside the amount you're spending, I have to take issue with your Olive Garden example. However I don't know if it's a fact, or some vague statistic you pulled off the top of your head which might not be exact.

 

[Zantra]

Personally, Tsu and I can get by on a few million a year. We like to gamble away most of it.

A few million? You've been holding out on us Daddy Warbucks. can I bum a few hundo thou?lol

 

[BobG]

It may feel like a step down for her, and you're right, Evo - people get used to what hey are used to - but I think its better to have it a little tough as a teen because you do get used to it and it makes it easier to live within your means when you are older. Even as a sligtly below average young engineer (I got a late start), my lifestyle feels downright opulent compared to my teenage years.

Yeah, tell me about it. The clothes my parents paid for, they got to pick out. The clothes I paid for, I got to pick out. A $1.25 allowance a week so we could have a drink with the lunches we packed at home? Get real, my mom only bought braunshweigger (or however it's spelled - I try to block it from my memory). Geez, where'd these people come from? You'd think my parents grew up in the depression or during World War II or ... :uhh: oh, yeah, I guess that explains it.

Anyway, suffice it to say, the kids in my family got part time jobs pretty early.

 

[Evo]

Yes, she's had it good. Fortunately she's very bright and she knows that she has it very easy right now and it will never be this easy again. We've discussed it. It keeps her focused on doing well in school and she understands the importance of being able to get a good job.

If she wants something and I say no, she does not argue with me. If I tell her to stop spending, she does.

It was her birthday on the third and all I bought her was a card. I could tell she looked disapointed, and I reminded her she had just bought herself a bunch of sweaters the week before, so Happy Birthday! She laughed and said "good point".

 

[Moonbear]

Regarding food, I eat out at a sit-down restaurant of Applebees, Friday's, Olive Garden, or comparable quality (low-end, but decent sit down) once or twice a week. I always get the most expensive meal of any of my friends. A steak-and-shrimp combo for ~$18 is my usual at Friday's. But that's not a normal thing for me.

On a normal day, I eat a Wendy's, or Subway, or grocery store chicken ceasar salad lunch. I never pay more than $10, often less than $5. For dinner, I'm a little lazy and I never cook for real. Canned beef stew is a usual ($.50 - $1) and if I'm feeling like gourmet, a half a bag of a pre-cooked meal-in-a-bag chicken stir fry or something of the like (~$2.50).

:yuck: I can't believe how many folks here are claiming these chain restaurants are "decent quality" food. You could make the same meal at home for about $1, and without overcooked pasta. What it is is overpriced food. I only eat at those places when I'm traveling and just need to find a place to eat. It's barely a step above fast food in my book. And canned beef stew. Russ, gosh, you really need to take better care of yourself. My stepdad eats that stuff and I've always been hard pressed to see the difference between that and canned dogfood. :yuck:

But like I said before: your costs will inevitably expand to fill your money available. If your daughter didn't have the money for a $20 meal every night, she'd eat at Subway. It may feel like a step down for her, and you're right, Evo - people get used to what hey are used to - but I think its better to have it a little tough as a teen because you do get used to it and it makes it easier to live within your means when you are older. Even as a sligtly below average young engineer (I got a late start), my lifestyle feels downright opulent compared to my teenage years.

When I was in my late teens, my parents would leave me alone for the weekend while they went camping (they went every weekend and I got tired of going...camping to them is a trailer better equipped than most hotel rooms permanently parked in a campground). They would leave me with $20 for food for the entire weekend, and I'd manage to have change left at the end! I guess they expected me to order pizza and stuff like that, but I'd go to the grocery store, buy myself a package of chicken tenders for $2.50, get some vegetables, and make two dinners out of it. Lunches were just sandwiches (sometimes I'd splurge on a package of bacon and make BLTs), and I've never been a breakfast eater. I can't even fathom over $30/day for meals for a teenager! I can't fathom spending that much on myself on a regular basis.

 

[Chrono]

Yes, she's had it good. Fortunately she's very bright and she knows that she has it very easy right now and it will never be this easy again. We've discussed it. It keeps her focused on doing well in school and she understands the importance of being able to get a good job.

So...can I still teach her to cook? :shy:

 

[Kerrie]

For some reason, restaurant food here is not cheap.

But you can't buy it at a restaurant here for that price. An entree at Applebees, TGI Fridays, Olive Garden, etc... which I consider sit down fast food will start around $16. You "can" make healthy choices. Obviously I wish I could be home to make her food, or that she was willing to cook, but that's not going to happen. Since I make enough money that it isn't an issue, it's not an issue.

Now if she wanted to eat at restaurants where a meal for one person was $75 or more, I'd have an issue.

as long as she understands that spending that much money on food alone is not something everyone is able to do (especially if she wants to help those less fortunate then her in her career later in life). how would she be if suddenly the money wasn't there to go out as she does now and she is forced to spend $100 a week on food? the lifestyle change is often the hardest for some to scale down on when things in life put them through difficult situations.

so the question here shouldn't be how much money is sufficient for you, but what kind of lifestyle do you afford?

 

[Chi Meson]

please tell me:

1) how much to own a 1500 sq feet house or apartment in US
2) how much to buy a car as good as Honda Accord
3) how much to spend on petrol if you travel 300 km per week.
4) how much on food and drinks
5) water and electricity bill
6) telephone bill

Total = ______________ ?

What a freakin' hot thread! I guess we logical analytical type like to talk money!

ANyway, I can answer for coastal Connecticut:
1) USD 150,000--1,500,000 depending on neighborhood. Ours was 250,000 for 1700 sq feet. Mortgage 1600/month
2) 25,000 ? We bought used cars and paid in cash.
3) 60--80 ?
4) we don't drink, but food for 4 is 200/week.
5) water and electricity is 100/month for conservationalists, up to ten times that for conservatives.
6) 20/ month if you don't use it, sky is the limit if you make long-distance calls. I've seen a friend's bill that is regularly more per month than Evo's daughters food bill!

Overall our income is about 4000/month and out flow is just a little less.

Now you folks know way too much about me.

 

[Gokul43201]

5) water and electricity is 100/month for conservationalists, up to ten times that for conservatives.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

 

[Saint]

in California, about how much to BUY a 1500 sq ft house or apartment?
if you cook at home for 5 persons' dinner + lunch, buy stuff from market or WallMart, 50 dollar/week is enough to get fish/pork/vegetable ?

 

[Evo]

in California, about how much to BUY a 1500 sq ft house or apartment?
if you cook at home for 5 persons' dinner + lunch, buy stuff from market or WallMart, 50 dollar/week is enough to get fish/pork/vegetable ?

Housing in California can be very expensive, but I'm not up to date of housing costs there.

At Walmart, if you shop wisely, buy bulk cuts of meat, use coupons, buy only sale items, I don't know if you could feed a family of five very well on $50/week, but you could do it very reasonably. I actually shop at a couple of different stores for different items because of cost. At Walmart, my favorite coffee creamer costs .98 cents, at my regular grocery store it's $1.58. I often stop at Walmart on the way home from work and pick up a whole roasted chicken for $3.98, some evenings they will mark them down to $2.98 to sell them quickly. At the grocery store they are $5.98. But other items are sometimes cheaper at the grocery store. I can get a 20lb bag of cat food for $5.99 at the grocery store, the cheapest at Walmart is $7.99. Go figure, I guess Walmart is not cat friendly.

 

[Zantra]

in California, about how much to BUY a 1500 sq ft house or apartment?
if you cook at home for 5 persons' dinner + lunch, buy stuff from market or WallMart, 50 dollar/week is enough to get fish/pork/vegetable ?

The overall average home in california is $350K If you buy that house/condo on the coast- you will pay about 5-700k.. further inland away from the coast you can get it for low 300's.

$75-100/week is more realistic to feed 5 people that type of food. Of course sea food is a premium. If you give up that, you can probably spend more like 50-75/week.

 

[shmoe]

I can get a 20lb bag of cat food for $5.99 at the grocery store, the cheapest at Walmart is $7.99. Go figure, I guess Walmart is not cat friendly.

What kind of cat food? Do you know what a 20lb bag of Iams goes for? It's about $33 Canadian here at Walmart or most grocery stores that carry it. Just curious what the cost of living for felines is down there.

 

[Evo]

What kind of cat food? Do you know what a 20lb bag of Iams goes for? It's about $33 Canadian here at Walmart or most grocery stores that carry it. Just curious what the cost of living for felines is down there.

$33? More like $18 here. Cat food isn't expensive here.

 

[cragwolf]

But like I said before: your costs will inevitably expand to fill your money available.

Well, you can repeat it, but it doesn't make it inevitable. In the past year my salary has almost doubled (it was very low), but my spending habits haven't changed. And I don't feel the urge to change them. Like most things, it depends on the person.

 

[Monique]

It's very easy to spend that much on food eating out. Even if she only eats 2 meals a day, staying under $30 a day is difficult. Let's say she eats lunch at Hardee's, a hamburger, fries and drink are going to cost around $6. For dinner, let's say she eats at Olive Garden (cheap), $16.95 for the entree, $1.25 for an iced tea, she splits an appetizer with a friend ($3.50 for her half), that's $21.70 BEFORE tax and tip. Minimum tip (15%) is $3.26, but like me, she always leaves a minimum $5 tip for dinner, so before tax, and no dessert, that's $26.70 just for dinner. Plus lunch that's $32.70. Of course this doesn't include a few sodas during the day, at $1.25 for a small drink at a fast food place that can easily add another $5, if she wants a snack during the day, that's even more.

So, realistically, eating only two meals a day at $37.70 a day x 30 days a month, her food costs are $1,131.00.

Where the heck do you people eat??

Just started reading this thread.. I'm amazed by the lifestyle! EVO! I usually eat at home :uhh:

But seriously, growing up I always had to take care of my own expenses. I actually always paid my parents for the food/electricity/heat I was consuming when living with them.. isn't that usual? Aren't you worried that letting your daughter consume so much will make her prone to putting herself in debt when living on her own?

 

[Kerrie]

Just started reading this thread.. I'm amazed by the lifestyle! EVO! I usually eat at home :uhh:

But seriously, growing up I always had to take care of my own expenses. I actually always paid my parents for the food/electricity/heat I was consuming when living with them.. isn't that usual? Aren't you worried that letting your daughter consume so much will make her prone to putting herself in debt when living on her own?

i think her daughter is under age 18 which in America is still considered a child, which by law Evo is required to support her as she sees fit . if she was say 21 and not going to school, then it might be more usual for her daughter to compensate her for food and utilities. i do admire Evo's devotion to supporting her daughter and ensuring she has it good. i think as long as her daughter understands and appreciates what she has (because i do believe many youths her age do not have it this well) she won't take it for granted and expect this lifestyle to be a standard.

i was raised to eat at home as much as possible too. for example, last night i spent $18.00 on food for this weekend on my husband and i (kids are with their dad this weekend) at Trader Joe's (you got to check them out!). the meals i bought included Ahi Tuna steak, cous cous, salad, new potatoes, chicken tenders, eggs (breakfast), orange juice and veggie chips. we eat very healthy with lots of proteins, veggies and "good" carbs. the time it takes to make this stuff is minimal considering how much money we are saving.

 

[Monique]

i think her daughter is under age 18 which in America is still considered a child

When I turned 16 and started going to college I had to stand on my own feet, I think most people do around here. But there is a more socialized system here, where the government provides part of the living expenses for students.. like an allowence.

 

[Evo]

Aren't you worried that letting your daughter consume so much will make her prone to putting herself in debt when living on her own?

You'd have to know her to understand that she "gets it". She knows that her ability right now to afford things is a temporary luxury. She'd rather eat at Taco Bell every night and spend $3.99 for the #5 meal deal. I am the one that prefers her to get a decent meal at least once a day. I guess I didn't make that clear. Of course that doesn't always happen, she will eat junk or skip meals, which is why I have a low monthly range of $600.

She does love to buy clothes though. The thing is, if I tell her to stop spending, she does. Honestly she's drastically cut back over the past year.

She's not an airhead that can't understand money or living on a budget. I was more concerned about her older sister that lived with her father. He is an idiot when it comes to money. He has always spent beyond his means, he always buys the most expensive items, eats at lavish restaurants, at one time he had 27 briefcases that cost $600 each on average. He has an entire dresser full of expensive watches, I lost count of them, they're like candy to him. Same thing with sunglasses. He'd buy a $200 pair of non-prescription designer sunglasses, go to lunch, leave them at the restaurant, decide it's not worth his time to go get them and just buy another pair. This happened ALL OF THE TIME. He would do things like buy a cd player (back when they were a couple of hundred dollars), decide he didn't want it and put it in the trash. I got it out of the trash because it hadn't even been taken out of the box yet. He saw me bring it into the house and he got furious, telling me to throw it back out because he didn't want that style, he was going to buy another. I told him to take it back to the store and exchange it. He said that was too much trouble to go through an exchange. I said I'd take it back and we got into a terrible argument.

When I threw him out, he had racked up over $292,000 in CREDIT CARD debt alone, that's more than some people's mortgages. At 18-23% interest, I figured Mars would be colonized before he could pay them off. I told him he needed professional help.

My older daughter learned quickly that when you support yourself you need to have a budget, and she has adapted even though she lived with him for several years. She learned it the hard way, the first couple of months she ran out of money before the end of the month and had no money for food. She also lived for almost a year on ramen noodles. Hey, I love ramen noodles.

My younger daughter that lives with me likes to buy things, but she doesn't have to buy things. She understands budgets and bills. I pay cash for everything, unfortunately you need credit cards for hotels and rental cars.

My younger daughter knows that when she goes off to college, no more shopping. A couple of months ago she came to me with a complete list of her anticipated expenses, she had checked into tuition for the schools she wants to attend, costs of books, boarding, etc... to see if it was acceptable. She's a good kid. I keep telling her that she needs to make LOTS of money when she grows up because she will be supporting me when I get old.

Monique, your parents let you pay them? Can I adopt you?

 

[Evo]

i think her daughter is under age 18 which in America is still considered a child, which by law Evo is required to support her as she sees fit

If she wasn't such a good kid, I wouldn't be as willing. When I see the problems that some of her friends are putting their parents through, I count my blessings. I'd rather let her buy a new pair of shoes than shuck out $50,000 on legal fees like the parents of her best friend, he just can't stay out of trouble. Not to mention the $$$ they spent on that private boarding school they sent him off to thinking it would keep him out of trouble. I'm getting off cheap.

i was raised to eat at home as much as possible too. for example, last night i spent $18.00 on food for this weekend on my husband and i (kids are with their dad this weekend) at Trader Joe's (you got to check them out!). the meals i bought included Ahi Tuna steak, cous cous, salad, new potatoes, chicken tenders, eggs (breakfast), orange juice and veggie chips. we eat very healthy with lots of proteins, veggies and "good" carbs. the time it takes to make this stuff is minimal considering how much money we are saving.

Ooh, Kerrie that sounds good!

 

[JasonRox]

I believe you that she understands it, but I just think it is that easy to stop a habit like this.

A habit is a habit. Not only is this a habit, it is also an addiction.

i.e. Your ex-husband.

The more you do something, the more prone you become to HAVE to do it.

People learn to spend even though THEY KNOW they can't, but it is an addiction.

In all honesty... if she truly understands the value of a dollar, she would be cooking meals.

NOTE: Someone with a spending problem is not an idiot. It is a problem just like any other.

EDIT: Being addicted to math or physics is no different.

 

[Monique]

You'd have to know her to understand that she "gets it".

Yes, I do believe that. It sounds like you did teach her good standards and she knows the value of things.

But important: Make sure she knows exactly how much she is spending and on what, don't let the food and the clothes be a consolation for something missed.

 

[Evo]

NOTE: Someone with a spending problem is not an idiot. It is a problem just like any other.

He has a problem, but he's also an idiot. Example - He had wiped out my savings account that I had before we got married. I kept telling him we needed to save money, it was important to have savings.

So, one day he comes up to me and hands me a savings account book. I asked him where he got the money to put into the savings. He wrote a credit check off of one of the credit cards (which charged 23% interest) and deposited the money into a savings account (which paid 5% interest). I tried to explain to him that this "savings" account was costing us money. I told him to close the savings account, pay the penalty and pay back the credit card. It would save us money in the long run. He also couldn't balance a check book.

Trust me, he's an idiot.

 

[Moonbear]

When I turned 16 and started going to college I had to stand on my own feet, I think most people do around here. But there is a more socialized system here, where the government provides part of the living expenses for students.. like an allowence.

I think that is common in Europe, right? To start college around 16? In the US, students don't typically start college until they are 17 or 18 (depending on when their birthday is...most are 18).

Monique, I think your experience is something that really doesn't happen as much with the current generation...their parents spoil them a lot more. Even in my generation, it was not as common as is used to be, but when I was growing up, yes, adult children (talk about an oxymoron) living at home with their parents would be expected to pay a small amount toward rent or utility bills. Not really what you'd pay if you were out on your own, but enough to keep you responsible and still let you save up some of your money so you'd be able to afford to move out sooner than later! I'm somewhat apalled nowadays by the number of kids still living home with their parents well into their 20s. Then again, in my generation, we didn't like our parents enough to want to live with them. The biggest incentive to get your act together and find your own place to live was to get out from under your parents' rules. The current generation seems to act more like best friends with their parents.

Evo, will you let me go shopping with your daughter. I actually hate shopping, but the toughest thing about moving up from being a grad student/post-doc to a faculty position was that after all those years of wearing the same old clothes, I needed to buy a LOT of clothes to be more professional in appearance (yes, I know there are plenty of profs who still show up to work in jeans, and I do occassionally myself, but there are a lot more meetings where you need to look professional, and since I'm still young (or at least look that way ), if I wear jeans and t-shirts, I still get mistaken for a grad student! Anyway, the point I think I started out making is that, yes, I was able to live on a lower budget previously, but as I increased my salary, and rank, I have additional expenses I didn't have as a student, such as needing to maintain a nicer wardrobe, and I have a house, not a two bedroom apt, so there are more rooms that need furnishing. Even if I still lived in an apt, my old garage sale furniture would have needed replacing because it was becoming wobbly from so many moves. So, it's partly true that as your salary increases, you do usually end up with more expenses to go along with it, but it doesn't need to.

 

[Evo]

Evo, will you let me go shopping with your daughter.

Certainly.

I don't like shopping either. I want to get in and out of the store as quickly as possible.

Funny, I was spoiled rotten growing up. I never had to ask for anything. My father could only show love with money and I always had the nicest, newest, "everything" of any of my friends. I got a new car on my birthday every year since I turned 16. My father paid all of my expenses for several years after I moved out.

I am a coupon clipping, low budget, low maintenance, do it your selfer. I cannot bring myself to buy expensive clothes or shoes or purses. I think it's a terrible waste of money.

I work with a bunch of clothing snobs. One manager was saying that she didn't hire a woman because she was wearing cheap shoes! These women actually judge people by their shoes and handbags! I had never heard of Joan and David. I know they look down on me because I don't wear designer clothes and I think they're pathetic snobs. I have to wear suits to work, but I look for sales. I tend to shop at the end of season when everything is clearance priced.

 

[SergejVictorov]

She's going to Switzerland in January.

Might I ask what area she is going to? And is she visiting Switzerland as an exchange student? Just curious

 

[Evo]

Might I ask what area she is going to? And is she visiting Switzerland as an exchange student? Just curious

She will be staying with friend's of her father's that live on a lake on the Swiss side, the other side of the lake is France. It sounds like Lake Geneva. I don't have all the details yet. She's going on break from school, she will also travel through France and Italy.

Her father is sending her, which is why I don't know exactly where she is going yet.

 

[SergejVictorov]

Yes, it's most likely Lake Geneva. It's a very nice place to stay. And since this thread is about money, I have to say that it's also pretty expensive, but this applies to almost every place in Switzerland to be honest

 

[Evo]

I would love to go to Switzerland. Perhaps someday in the near future. I love mountians.

 

[franznietzsche]

For me, with a teenage daughter, in the midwest, $10,000 a month average net take home pay just barely cuts it. Ok, she's spoiled. She's going to Switzerland in January. She has a much grander lifestyle than I do.

But yesterday I told her I was cold (the weather is getting chilly) and she bought me a bunch of incredible warm clothes (from her own earnings) so I would be comfortable.

Thats $120,000 a year. If that barely cuts it in the midwest, you have some spending priority issues, or a massive amount of personal debt to pay off. Sending your kid to switzerland? That is not barely cutting it.

 

[Moonbear]

I work with a bunch of clothing snobs. One manager was saying that she didn't hire a woman because she was wearing cheap shoes! These women actually judge people by their shoes and handbags!

Did you tell them that if they were wearing cheap shoes, maybe they really were the one who needed the job? How can you tell anyway? Shoes are shoes. Besides, the fancier the shoes, the less comfortable they are. Bah, I can do without that!

I had never heard of Joan and David.

:uhh: I guess I haven't either. Who are Joan and David?

I know they look down on me because I don't wear designer clothes and I think they're pathetic snobs. I have to wear suits to work, but I look for sales. I tend to shop at the end of season when everything is clearance priced.

Unless you're working in the fashion industry, that just makes no sense to expect people to wear designer clothing to work. In men's suits, I can reasonably tell there is a difference between certain brands...a cheap suit is obvious, so I can see getting one or two of the better suits for those really important business meetings. But, with women's suits, honestly, I don't see much difference in quality whether I pick up something off the rack at JC Penneys or walk into some boutique shop, etc. Besides, when it comes to womens' suits, those name brand ones look like old lady suits to me...those stuffy looking things wives of politicians wear. :yuck: Save the fashion show for parties and keep business attire business-like. The most important quality in a suit, for me, is wrinkle-resistant!

 

[Evo]

:uhh: I guess I haven't either. Who are Joan and David?

Overpriced shoes for snobs. I don't even recognize the names of the designer shoes and purses these women talk about.

The most important quality in a suit, for me, is wrinkle-resistant!

I would love them to be machine washable!