How much work to push a spring up/down a distance of y?

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves calculating the work required to displace the midpoint of a spring, which is initially relaxed and attached between two walls, by a distance y. The subject area pertains to mechanics, specifically the behavior of springs and work-energy principles.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the relationship between the displacement of the spring and the work done, with some attempting to apply the work formula for springs. There is confusion regarding the correct interpretation of the spring's length during displacement and the application of Pythagorean theorem in this context.

Discussion Status

Some participants have provided hints and guidance regarding the need to focus on the change in length of the spring rather than resolving forces. Multiple interpretations of the problem are being explored, particularly concerning the geometry involved in the displacement of the spring.

Contextual Notes

There is mention of a misunderstanding regarding the total length of the spring when displaced, as well as the implications of stretching at both ends of the spring. Participants are grappling with the correct application of the work formula in light of these considerations.

Jim01
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Homework Statement



The ends of a relaxed spring of length L and force constant k are attached to two points on two walls separated by a distance L. How much work must you do to push the midpoint of the spring up or down a distance of y?



Homework Equations



W = -1/2k(b2-a2) (after integration), moving from y=a to y=b



The Attempt at a Solution



I'm completely lost on this. The first thing that I notice is that when you push down on the midpoint of the spring, you form two right triangles. This leads me to believe that y will go from a value of zero to the value of Fy, where F is the downward force on the spring. So I made a force diagram and came up with summation of forces.

[tex]\sum[/tex]Fx = 0

wx = 0
Fx = L/2

Fx= 0

[tex]\sum[/tex]Fy = 0

wy = -mg
N = mg
Fy = -Fcos[tex]\theta[/tex]

wy-N-Fy = 0

Fy = wy-N = -2mg

I attempted to use the Fy value as b in the W = -1/2k(b2-a2) formula but this led me to a wrong answer. I then tried to put Fx into the equation, thinking that maybe I needed to get Fy from the net forces. This led me nowhere either (I was grasping at straws here).


I am obviously going about this the wrong way. Since it involves the work on a spring, I know that I must use the W = -1/2k(b2-a2) formula. I just have no idea how to get the value of b. What concept(s) am I missing here?
 
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There is no need to resolve forces. The crux of the question lies within this: by what length has the spring been stretched? It then results in a clear application of that formula you are brandishing around.
Hint: It involves the right angle triangles you've been talking about and Pythagora's theorem of course
 
Fightfish said:
There is no need to resolve forces. The crux of the question lies within this: by what length has the spring been stretched? It then results in a clear application of that formula you are brandishing around.
Hint: It involves the right angle triangles you've been talking about and Pythagora's theorem of course

I know I'm thickheaded because I'm still not seeing it. If I set the opposite to y, the adjacent to L/2, this gives me a hypotenus of the square root of y2+(L/2)2.

So at rest, the spring length is L. So a=L and b= the square root of y2+(L/2)2. However when I plug this into my formula, it still doesn't work. I end up with

W = -1/2 k [(square root of y2+(L/2)2 - L2]

= - 1/2k [y2+(L/2)2 - L2]

= - 1/2k [y2 - 3/4 L2]

= k(-1/2y2 + 3/8 L2)
 
Last edited:
This is because you forgot to consider the fact that the spring is stretched on both ends. So the length of the extended spring is [tex]2\sqrt{y^2 + (\frac{L}{2})^2}[/tex].
 

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