How to Derive Complex Equations Using Chain and Product/Quotient Rules?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion focuses on the process of deriving complex equations using the chain rule in conjunction with the product and quotient rules in calculus. Participants explore specific examples and the order of operations required for differentiation.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asks about the process for differentiating equations that require both the chain rule and product/quotient rule, providing specific examples.
  • Another participant suggests taking a step-by-step approach, emphasizing the importance of clarity in notation and the use of parentheses to avoid ambiguity.
  • A third participant reiterates the described processes for applying the chain rule first followed by the product/quotient rule, providing a detailed breakdown of the differentiation steps for the first example.
  • A humorous comment is made regarding the phrase "do it in strps," questioning its meaning in the context of differentiation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the necessity of using both the chain rule and product/quotient rule for the examples provided, but there is no consensus on a singular method or approach, as different interpretations of the process are presented.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight the importance of notation and clarity in mathematical expressions, suggesting that misinterpretations can lead to confusion in the differentiation process.

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hello!
1) what is the process to get the derivative of an equation that requires you to do first the chain rule and then the product/quotient rule, eg. sin(x^2(x+1))?
2) what is the process to get the derivative of an equation that requires you to do first the product/quotient rule and then the chain rule, eg. sin(e^x+1)(cos(x^2+1))?
thanks!
 
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Step by step. Just do the first step first leaving d/dx symbols where they belong. Then see if more can be done to the resulting parts. There are too many combinations to try to memorize formulas for them all. Baby steps gets the job done.

I assume you mean (x^2)*(x+1) and not x^(2*(x+1)). Parentheses are your friends. Use them wherever it might otherwise be ambiguous.

d/dx( sin((x^2)(x+1)) ) = cos((x^2)(x+1)) * d/dx ((x^2)(x+1))
= cos((x^2)(x+1)) * [ d/dx x^2 ]*(x+1) + (x^2)[d/dx(x+1)])
= cos((x^2)(x+1)) * [ (2*x(x+1) + x^2) ]
 
1. You just described it ... you do the chain rule first then the product/quotient rule.
2. Same here... you just described the process. It is the process of using the product rule followed by the pricess of doing the chain rule.

The trick is to do it in strps.

Eg 1.

##\frac{d}{dx}\left ( \sin\left ( x^2 (x+1) \right) \right)## ...put u=x^2 (x+1) and apply the chain rule.

##= \cos u \frac{du}{dx}## now evaluate du/dx using the product rule.

##\frac{du}{dx} = 2x(x+1) + x^2##

... now substitute back.
 
Simon Bridge said:
The trick is to do it in strps.
stirrups? As in, astride a horse? :oldbiggrin:
 

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