How to find the value of f'(x) at c

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the derivative of functions, specifically f'(x) for f(x) = sin(x) and f(x) = cos(x), at specific points c, such as c = π/4 and c = 3π/2. The context includes the application of the limit definition of the derivative and the use of trigonometric identities.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation, Mathematical reasoning, Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants present the limit definition of the derivative and apply it to f(x) = sin(x) and f(x) = cos(x).
  • One participant suggests using the limit definition to find f'(c) for c = π/4 and c = 3π/2.
  • Another participant questions how the limit $$\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{\cos(h)+1}$$ equals zero, providing a calculation to support their point.
  • Several participants reiterate the steps for deriving f'(x) for sin(x) and cos(x), emphasizing the use of trigonometric identities and limits.
  • There is a repeated inquiry about the specific application of c = π/4 in the context of the derivative.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the application of the limit definition of the derivative, but there is no consensus on the specific results for f'(c) at c = π/4 or the implications of the calculations presented.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about the application of specific values of c and how they relate to the derivative calculations. There are also unresolved questions about the behavior of certain limits.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students learning about derivatives in calculus, particularly those interested in trigonometric functions and their derivatives.

rahulk1
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How to find the value of f'(x) at cif

1. f(x)=sinx, c=pi/4
2. f(x)=sinx, c=3pi/2
3.2. f(x)=cosx, c=0, pi/2, pi, 3pi/2, 2pi
 
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Since you posted in the Pre-Calculus forum, I suppose you are to use the definition:

$$f'(x)\equiv\lim_{h\to0}\frac{f(x+h)-f(x)}{h}$$

So, for $f(x)=\sin(x)$, we have:

$$f'(x)\equiv\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(x+h)-\sin(x)}{h}$$

Using the angle-sum identity for the sine function, we may write:

$$f'(x)=\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(x)(\cos(h)-1)+\cos(x)\sin(h)}{h}$$

$$f'(x)=\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\cos(h)-1}{h}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

$$f'(x)=\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\cos^2(h)-1}{h(\cos(h)+1)}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

Using a Pythagorean identity on the first limit on the RHS, we obtain:

$$f'(x)=-\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin^2(h)}{h(\cos(h)+1)}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

$$f'(x)=-\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}\cdot\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{(\cos(h)+1)}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

Using the fact that $$\lim_{u\to0}\frac{\sin(u)}{u}=1$$, we have:

$$f'(x)=-\sin(x)(1)(0)+\cos(x)(1)=\cos(x)$$

Can you now obtain a result for $f(x)=\cos(x)$?
 
MarkFL said:
Since you posted in the Pre-Calculus forum, I suppose you are to use the definition:

$$f'(x)\equiv\lim_{h\to0}\frac{f(x+h)-f(x)}{h}$$

So, for $f(x)=\sin(x)$, we have:

$$f'(x)\equiv\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(x+h)-\sin(x)}{h}$$

Using the angle-sum identity for the sine function, we may write:

$$f'(x)=\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(x)(\cos(h)-1)+\cos(x)\sin(h)}{h}$$

$$f'(x)=\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\cos(h)-1}{h}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

$$f'(x)=\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\cos^2(h)-1}{h(\cos(h)+1)}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

Using a Pythagorean identity on the first limit on the RHS, we obtain:

$$f'(x)=-\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin^2(h)}{h(\cos(h)+1)}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

$$f'(x)=-\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}\cdot\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{(\cos(h)+1)}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

Using the fact that $$\lim_{u\to0}\frac{\sin(u)}{u}=1$$, we have:

$$f'(x)=-\sin(x)(1)(0)+\cos(x)(1)=\cos(x)$$

Can you now obtain a result for $f(x)=\cos(x)$?

Hi

Thanks for your suggestion

But what about c=pi/4 where are used

c=pi/4 in the answer
 
rahulk said:
Hi

Thanks for your suggestion

But what about c=pi/4 where are used

c=pi/4 in the answer

Well, if $f'(c)=\cos(c)$ and $$c=\frac{\pi}{4}$$...then what do you get?
 
MarkFL said:
Since you posted in the Pre-Calculus forum, I suppose you are to use the definition:

$$f'(x)\equiv\lim_{h\to0}\frac{f(x+h)-f(x)}{h}$$

So, for $f(x)=\sin(x)$, we have:

$$f'(x)\equiv\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(x+h)-\sin(x)}{h}$$

Using the angle-sum identity for the sine function, we may write:

$$f'(x)=\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(x)(\cos(h)-1)+\cos(x)\sin(h)}{h}$$

$$f'(x)=\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\cos(h)-1}{h}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

$$f'(x)=\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\cos^2(h)-1}{h(\cos(h)+1)}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

Using a Pythagorean identity on the first limit on the RHS, we obtain:

$$f'(x)=-\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin^2(h)}{h(\cos(h)+1)}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

$$f'(x)=-\sin(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}\cdot\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{(\cos(h)+1)}+\cos(x)\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{h}$$

Using the fact that $$\lim_{u\to0}\frac{\sin(u)}{u}=1$$, we have:

$$f'(x)=-\sin(x)(1)(0)+\cos(x)(1)=\cos(x)$$

Can you now obtain a result for $f(x)=\cos(x)$?

How sin(h)/(cos(h)+1 =0 please descibe
 
rahulk said:
How sin(h)/(cos(h)+1 =0 please descibe

$$\lim_{h\to0}\frac{\sin(h)}{\cos(h)+1}=\frac{\sin(0)}{\cos(0)+1}=\frac{0}{1+1}=0$$ :D
 

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