How to measure height above sea level

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around methods for measuring height above sea level, particularly in the context of laying sewer pipes. Participants explore various instruments and techniques used to achieve precise measurements, including GPS technology and leveling methods.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant inquires about the methods used to measure height above sea level with high precision when laying sewer pipes.
  • Another participant suggests that GPS satellites measure height by timing signals sent to and from the ground, although they express uncertainty about the precision of such measurements.
  • A participant questions the accuracy of typical GPS devices, noting that they usually have a precision of about 10-20 meters, and wonders if specialized instruments can achieve one-centimeter accuracy.
  • It is proposed that military-grade GPS devices might achieve accuracy down to one millimeter, and an alternative method using topography programs is mentioned.
  • A participant shares their experience with GPS surveys, stating that they achieved accuracy down to a couple of inches using a method called chain traverse, while also noting the potential for accumulated error.
  • Another participant explains that elevations are typically transferred from a known benchmark using leveling equipment, emphasizing that GPS is not usually used for high-accuracy elevation transfers.
  • One participant mentions that averaging multiple stationary GPS fixes can improve accuracy beyond the typical individual fix accuracy of 3 meters, and references Differential GPS (DGPS) as potentially achieving one-centimeter accuracy in certain applications.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying views on the accuracy of GPS technology for measuring height above sea level, with some suggesting it can be precise while others argue that traditional leveling methods are more reliable for high accuracy. No consensus is reached regarding the best method for achieving precise measurements.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in accuracy depending on the method used, the equipment available, and the specific application. The discussion reflects a range of experiences and assumptions about the capabilities of GPS and leveling techniques.

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When drawing sewer pipes, I often include the height above sea level within one centimeter to get the correct fall, simply cause I've been told to do so. I'm just curious as to how this height is actually measured by the people who actually lay these pipes? Is there some kind of instrument that tells you this height directly and with such good precision?
 
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GPS style Satalites do it. I think

they time how long it takes to get from the satalites position to the ground and back to the satalite, feed oit into a program and, whala its there. that's what i suspect.
 
And it's good down to one centimeter?! Don't "normal" GPS handy-things have a precision of like 10-20 meters or something...? Maybe these instruments are perfectly tuned for this...thx!
 
the Military keep all the best ones so they might have one up to 1mm , maybe.

you could always use a topography program for it
 
I have had surveys done for my installation. They used GPS. The accuracy I was given was, if all goes well, down to a couple of inches. That being said, that was also doing, what they referred to, as a chain traverse (or something like that) in which they started at their control point and traversed about 20 points in succession back to the original point. In that circumstance I could see the couple of inches being an accumulated error. You do have to ask yourself if the accuracy you are looking for is necessary.
 
Elevations are typically transferred from a known point, called a bench mark, to a project point with 'Level Loops' using equipment that is just for leveling. You run a loop to determine closure, i.e. subtract the change in elevations going one way from the change coming back and divide it by the length of the run.

There are different levels of rigor for different types of work. The closure depends on both the error and the length of the loop. A typical closure of 1:10,000 is achieved with good equipment and methods.

GPS is not typically used to transfer elevations if a high degree of accuracy is required.
 
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When taking many stationary fixes and averaging them, you can get much more accurate than the typical individual fix accuracy of 3m (with Dgps).
 
russ_watters said:
When taking many stationary fixes and averaging them, you can get much more accurate than the typical individual fix accuracy of 3m (with Dgps).

IIRC, Differential GPS can be accurate down to 1cm (theoretical). They do use DGPS units with enough accuracy on an airplane to accurately measure pitch, yaw, and roll, so I know they are very accurate in the correct applications.
 

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